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Post by Joseph Joestar on Oct 8, 2015 17:33:22 GMT -5
IIRC, there's some homoerotic subtext in Undying, particularly with the main character and another NPC. Ok, then it's not a lost cause... I've only played the old Nightbreed PC games because I love the movie, it's so bad. On the topic of Nightbreed/Cabal, it has probably the funniest attempt at describing female masturbation because it's totally obvious that Barker has no clue about how women junk works. Also I have a pretty good anecdote about Barker from working at a sci-fi convention, and how our con director tried to get him interested in being a guest at it (he passed, but at least he thought it was funny what they said).
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Post by Snarboo on Oct 8, 2015 22:31:04 GMT -5
For those wondering how you read journal entries, you need to press 'F3' on your keyboard to view them. Why, I have no idea, especially since you can't even rebind the journal button.
Edit: Another quick tip: there are upgrades you can find which permanently upgrade your spells, up to a maximum of five levels. When the magic stone is equipped, it also bumps your currently active spell up one level. This is true even if your spell is max level, allowing it to do more damage or last longer than it would otherwise!
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Post by GamerL on Oct 9, 2015 4:11:17 GMT -5
Clive Barker's Undying is a really good game and flat out gorgeous in parts, despite it's age (especially the monastery in the snow level) I wish there were more games like it that tried to capture the "vibe" of an author's work while telling an original story, imagine a Stephen King game like that for example (yeah, I'm aware of all those Ubisoft Tom Clancy games) My biggest gripe about Clive Barker's Undying is that you don't get to infect your opponents with HIV without telling them. Humongous oversight. Dude, what? I'm afraid you're gonna have to explain yourself with that joke, I know Clive Barker is gay but I've never heard anything about that.
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Post by Joseph Joestar on Oct 9, 2015 7:05:53 GMT -5
My biggest gripe about Clive Barker's Undying is that you don't get to infect your opponents with HIV without telling them. Humongous oversight. Dude, what? I'm afraid you're gonna have to explain yourself with that joke, I know Clive Barker is gay but I've never heard anything about that. Clive Barker got sued by an ex boyfriend for giving him "the package"; it was a pretty nasty court case, and among other things his ex accused Barker of having gotten HIV by fucking his cousin.
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Post by Weevil on Oct 10, 2015 2:51:44 GMT -5
For those wondering how you read journal entries, you need to press 'F3' on your keyboard to view them. Why, I have no idea, especially since you can't even rebind the journal button. Edit:Another quick tip: there are upgrades you can find which permanently upgrade your spells, up to a maximum of five levels. When the magic stone is equipped, it also bumps your currently active spell up one level. This is true even if your spell is max level, allowing it to do more damage or last longer than it would otherwise! Yeah, I was really annoyed with the journal entries as first. It wasn't straight forward nor was in listed in the key mappings. A couple other issues I have encountered with the game is reloading has ceased to work (I think it was after I changed keymappings for weapon and spellswapping but I can't tell) and when I try to run the game in windowed mode, it accelerates when around the flame particle effect. I can't really diagnose it but I am not the first person to encounter it apparently. I am saving my positive thoughts for my post-mortem. EDIT: I just realized I made one mistake that might have helped me with finding how to access the journal entries: READ THE MANUAL. I never do that anymore and just now remembered, the game came with one.
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Post by scotthdc on Oct 10, 2015 12:23:55 GMT -5
I voted for Sanctum, but I'm looking forward to playing this as well. It looks good. I'm installing from GOG right now.
Being October, I may play Sanctum as well, if I have time.
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Post by Weevil on Oct 10, 2015 18:04:38 GMT -5
I voted for Sanctum, but I'm looking forward to playing this as well. It looks good. I'm installing from GOG right now. Being October, I may play Sanctum as well, if I have time. You won't be disappointed if you play Undying. Just know there is some slight backtracking in portions but the game will try to tell you when that happens by spitting you out into an area you've been before. Also F3 to read the journal. This is actually vital because some entries actually give you hints on what to do plus you can look at your quest log.
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Post by Joseph Joestar on Oct 10, 2015 22:47:08 GMT -5
I just started it this afternoon - I'm guessing I'll need to tweak hotkeys and things, but so far it seems pretty easy to get into.
As far as the art design and stuff, it's funny looking at the family paintings - they all look evil and fucked up.
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Post by Weevil on Oct 11, 2015 0:57:44 GMT -5
I just started it this afternoon - I'm guessing I'll need to tweak hotkeys and things, but so far it seems pretty easy to get into. As far as the art design and stuff, it's funny looking at the family paintings - they all look evil and fucked up. Make sure to Scrye early on when you hear the stone tell you to near portraits. You aren't too far off.
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Post by scotthdc on Oct 11, 2015 15:16:38 GMT -5
I'm through the first level, after the acquisition of the first additional spell. (I stopped playing for the night when I accidentally did a quick load instead of a quick save.) In spite of the age of the graphics, I have definitely been startled and creeped.
Yeah, I like that a lot.
Thanks, that's a good tip. While definitely paying attention, I managed to not understand that I had acquired a new spell to use. I discovered it while looking through the journal.
Regarding key binding, as a modern WASD with mouselook user, I set:
-V: item use -B: item selection -E: weapon select -R: weapon reload (whatever the game calls it) -G: spell selection I think -T: sneak I think
I suspect in time, I will also bind the number keys so that it's closer to Doom or something.
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Post by Joseph Joestar on Oct 11, 2015 16:09:30 GMT -5
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Post by scotthdc on Oct 12, 2015 23:08:54 GMT -5
This game is fun. I'm usually too creeped out by horror games, but I think the retro graphics help distance me a little (not a bad thing.)
I am playing on medium. For saves, I decided to save a) before I venture to a new area, and b) if I get killed more than once or twice. I don't want to save-scum, but the game is made with save-anywhere in mind.
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Post by scotthdc on Oct 15, 2015 11:53:10 GMT -5
Two points that might be obvious, but required a learning curve for me:
1. The ether traps are items, and items are not triggered like weapons. Put them in your inventory, switch to them, and then trigger them. Looks cool.
2. The ectoplasm + Gel'zibar stone (+ maybe a magic upgrade) = renewable and more effective on those house monsters than bullets.
I find that I miss having a Doom-like automap in the house. I've had to make a (bad) paper map to make up for it.
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Post by Feynman on Oct 15, 2015 17:00:58 GMT -5
The ectoplasm + Gel'zibar stone (+ maybe a magic upgrade) = renewable and more effective on those house monsters than bullets. This is going to vary a lot based on your aim. Enemies in Undying take more damage from headshots, and once you get used to their hopping movement pattern, Howlers can be defeated quite quickly with only one or two shots from the revolver. Once you get used to attacking Howlers that way, you can deal a lot more damage a lot more quickly, and use Ectoplasm either to finish off wounded Howlers, or as a filler attack while reloading.
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Post by Weevil on Oct 15, 2015 21:05:52 GMT -5
All right guys!
I finally finished Undying today. I am glad I gave this game a shot. For some odd reason, I remember it getting some negative feedback from one major magazine I read back in 2001 and never gave it a second thought. I also think I didn't have the best computer to run it when it came out. Either way, this game is a nice little gem.
First off, I enjoy stories based around the occult. Though I poke fun at his writing style now, I still have a special place in my heart for H.P. Lovecraft who is your go to for stories like Undying. I also really enjoyed the Hellboy vibe I got from it. Sure Patrick isn't exactly as grizzled as Hellboy, he is definitely in a similar situation as the first major arc of Hellboy (a family plagued by some eldritch curse that ends up tearing apart their ancestral household) not to mention uses a trusty revolver.
My knowledge of Undying was extremely limited going in. So I was expecting some run of the mill survival horror game like Alone in the Dark. Yes, it being first-person should have been an indicator to the contrary, but I didn't catch on. In any case, it was a nice surprise to find it was a fast-paced shooter with horror elements. I started off playing on Nightmare difficulty, but after dying a few times early on, I decided to go ahead and play it on Normal. I think it's the best choice because hit detection seems a bit wonky which leads to some frustrating deaths.
I actually opted to try playing through Undying using the default keybindings, against Feynman's recommendations, and I found them to be not too terrible. I did rebind my weapon and spell switching bindings (1 cycled through all my weapons and 2 cycled through all my spells) and I ended up using caps lock for reloading when alt stopped working due to either an unintentional change in binding (likely, I was too lazy to look) or a bug. Either way, it didn't affect my experience too much once I was used to them.
The one thing I appreciated about the game was the creativity in the boss fights. Rather than simply shooting some weak spot or shooting them until they were dead, usually there was an extra layer of depth to them. I have mixed feelings on the fact that the game never really gives good hints (or I just overlooked them) on what to do to win the fights, it is nice to not have my hand held and discover it on my own. Also the checkpoint system is forgiving so it warrants trial and error.
For those who aren't aware, Ambrose is voiced by Clive Barker. Honestly, I wish they had gotten someone else to fit the character's appearance better, but it ends up being tolerable. I found it amusing how Aaron went from being an extremely gruesome ghost out of the four siblings to the goofy Slimer character that bothers you wherever you go. I also think Aaron looks a lot like a ginger Edgar Allan Poe. I am not sure if that is the intent, but it is amusing nonetheless.
One early issue I encountered was I had to google how to read my journal because I hadn't looked at the manual and it's not listed in the keybindings. I feel that it is a flaw in design, since I am certain not a lot of people read instruction manuals or think to refer to one. That's likely why manuals have gone the way of the dodo. The journal entries were a neat touch though. I bet for 2001, that was still a pretty new concept. And they were well-written. I was stuck at a portion of the game and only figured out where I needed to go by an entry that mentioned the next thing I needed to do. Between what other journal entries it was located and what it said, I was able to pinpoint the general area of my next objective.
I feel like Otto's role in the game was underdeveloped. There are some mentions of past events between Patrick and Otto, but nothing fleshed out. I figured maybe Barker had written a short story with Patrick and Otto in it but so far I can't find anything. Considering their dynamic, it would have been nice to get a little bit more as well as elaborate on one journal entry that established strong involvement between the two. I am trying to avoid explicit spoilers, but I want to say, I don't quite see the possible homoerotic subtext Snarboo was referring to. If that entry was it, it felt like something sinister more than homoerotic. But I think that even if that entry and/or one of Aaron's entries could remotely be considered homoerotic, sexuality isn't apparent or a strong focal point of the story.
A lot more can be said about Undying, but since it's halfway through the month, I will let others finish it and decide for themselves.
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