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Post by Sketcz-1000 on Apr 10, 2012 1:47:33 GMT -5
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Shou
New Member
Posts: 15
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Post by Shou on Apr 11, 2012 1:04:12 GMT -5
Guys, while I appreciate the desire to spread information, straight out speculating in articles like what was stated about the hardware is just not needed and ruins the reputation & quality level of the site.
The Crystal System was dubbed as such in Japan where an attempt was made to sell it like the MVS. Dedicated cabinets for games like this haven't existed since the early 90's in Asia. Cartridges for the Crystal System are small, around the size of an EA Mega Drive cart. The platform was also used for more arcade titles in Korea than MAME has documented.
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Post by Weasel on Apr 11, 2012 1:34:53 GMT -5
While I realize this might sound hypocritical (given what you've just accused the site of), but do you have sources for this?
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Post by Sketcz-1000 on Apr 11, 2012 1:52:49 GMT -5
The paragraph in question: This was an addition by Derboo - and there is no one I trust more when it comes to anything Korea related. Or facts in general. His second sentence, speculating on the "Crystal System" name, was indeed speculation. I thought about it, but decided to include it, because I felt that if the system was referred to as such, some/any kind of mention was needed. Perhaps I should even apologise for including it, since the addition was made based on informal discussion were having about an older draft of the article, prior to its publishing. Derboo also mentioned several other Korean titles, though I left these out for space/flow. I don't see any serious harm in speculation, as long as we explicitly state it's speculation. Videogame history is a patchy thing, where you can't always find the precise details. In some cases you never will. More than most people I am obsessive about facts and accuracy, visual fidelity, and so on - but in cases without sources, theory is all we have to go on. This is why we have feedback topics, and I appreciate that you signed up specifically to point this out. If you have a reputable source I'll change the text and add it, or we can look at rewording the sentence. In the event you don't have a direct source, perhaps even add your own text, offering an alternative theory? We're always happy to listen to feedback. And welcome to the forums.
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Post by Umdlye on Apr 11, 2012 15:28:11 GMT -5
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Post by Jonathan Ingram on Apr 11, 2012 18:40:35 GMT -5
I must say the passage about the system`s naming surprised me too. I remember reading about the Crystal System on Neo-Geo.com forums about nine or ten years ago(when it probably wasn`t even emulated yet) and how it was meant to be the successor of MVS of sorts.
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Shou
New Member
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Post by Shou on Apr 13, 2012 0:39:15 GMT -5
While I realize this might sound hypocritical (given what you've just accused the site of), but do you have sources for this? Let's take the statements one at a time. Check the original Japanese flyer for the game. The Japanese Wikipedia entry for Neo Geo also mentions the same. Anything that isn't a deluxe cab like an Initial D has been sold as a conversion kit since the mid 80's in Japan. You can check Japanese flyers of stuff like Capcom games and see they don't mention selling dedicated cabs but rather general cabs like their Q Grand Am which makes conversions easy. I own the hardware and games not dumped in MAME. I could easily take pics of them to do a comparison with other console or arcade carts. I also dump games for MAME and have over 800 PCBs in my personal collection so I'm a bit knowledgable on the subject.
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Post by Sketcz-1000 on Apr 13, 2012 1:39:26 GMT -5
I have edited the article slightly, to hopefully remove offending parts. If you'd like further changes, please mention them here and I will consider making them.
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Post by derboo on Apr 13, 2012 6:20:52 GMT -5
Thanks for the info! Check the original Japanese flyer for the game. Where? Is there a better scan than we used in the article? I can't find any mention of a Crystal System on what we've got. I would love to see an official print (or engravement on plastic) of the Crystal System name. "The Koreans" (by which I mean Enha Wiki) believe it's a Western-given nickname. The Japanese Wikipedia entry for Neo Geo also mentions the same. While Japanese Wikipedia articles on video games tend to be more accurate than the English ones, they have one big disadvantage - they don't care at all about sourcing (but neither does Enha, hence the speculation note). I own the hardware and games not dumped in MAME. I could easily take pics of them to do a comparison with other console or arcade carts. I also dump games for MAME and have over 800 PCBs in my personal collection so I'm a bit knowledgable on the subject. Pictures of anything written on the carts would be great, also a complete list of your games for the system (Enha didn't know Topblade V is a Zealer Board game, for example). You're not equipped to capture good screenshots by any chance, are you?
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Post by nickz on Apr 13, 2012 11:04:42 GMT -5
I found a picture of a Crystal of Kings cartridge. It's plugged into the arcade board, but you can see The Crystal of Kings on a sticker and Brezzasoft on both the system and the cartridge. www.gamesdbase.com/Media/SYSTEM/Arcade/PCB/big/The_Crystal_of_Kings_-_2001_-_BrezzaSoft.jpgI don't know what the Zealer board looks like. I found some mention of them while researching this, but no actual pictures. They sound like pretty similar systems, possibly the same, like Derboo said. If I can find one, I'll post it as soon as I can.
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macaw
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by macaw on Apr 15, 2012 8:42:18 GMT -5
Might as well post this here - Sketz every time you come across a problem in a game you seem to completely make shit up and then believe it to be real.
The PC88 version of XZR is not impossible to finish, the Alembic is just more hidden than in the MSX version. You need to fix that.
The MSX2 version of War of the Dead is not impossible without cheating, something tells me you didn't find the big knife. You need to fix that article too.
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Post by Sketcz-1000 on Apr 15, 2012 11:23:59 GMT -5
Might as well post this here - Sketz every time you come across a problem in a game you seem to completely make shit up and then believe it to be real. The PC88 version of XZR is not impossible to finish, the Alembic is just more hidden than in the MSX version. You need to fix that. Nothing encourages my apathy better than needlessly confrontational posts. A little reading/research does wonders. Here's the original thread where we played through XZR, with our concluding there might be a bug. This was based on comments from Japanese players: hg101.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=games&action=display&thread=5831&page=1Here's the quote in the article: Note the word theories in that. While I wish I had the power of the gods and was omniscient, the truth is I am not. Writing about old games is sometimes a matter of conjecture and educated guess work. You could have posted in the official Exile feedback topic, which clearly pointed to the Tokugawa forums solution regarding the matter: hg101.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=recent&action=display&thread=5954As far as I'm concerned, the link in the feedback topic addresses the issue until I have the free time and inclination to edit the HTM file and re-upload it. Isn't the big knife in the school attic? Regardless, getting anywhere once outside the church is an uphill struggle. Have you completed the MSX release? It is awful, poorly designed, and unfairly difficult - and I say this as someone who plays and enjoys a lot of difficult games. Besides, if you checked the feedback topic, you'll see this issue was already addressed: hg101.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=recent&thread=7594&page=1#169578I have a long list of articles to correct and update, and I'll get to them when I can.
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macaw
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by macaw on Apr 15, 2012 23:06:31 GMT -5
Nothing encourages my apathy better than needlessly confrontational posts. Nothing needlessly confrontational, just pointing out a fact. In two articles you flat out stated games were impossible to finish. If a little research does wonders, then you should have found one of the only Japanese pages about the pc88 XZR version (thats easy to find) and has been up for years and clearly shows pics of the end of the game www.geocities.jp/rip_gamer/xzr/xzr.htmlAnd War of the dead is pretty easy with the big knife. I give you props for covering this obscure Japanese stuff, just be more careful when it comes to jumping to over the top conclusions, especially when you cant read the language in the games.
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Post by Sketcz-1000 on Apr 16, 2012 4:51:37 GMT -5
I've updated it!
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Shou
New Member
Posts: 15
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Post by Shou on Apr 19, 2012 20:04:42 GMT -5
Thanks for the info! Where? Is there a better scan than we used in the article? I can't find any mention of a Crystal System on what we've got. I would love to see an official print (or engravement on plastic) of the Crystal System name. "The Koreans" (by which I mean Enha Wiki) believe it's a Western-given nickname. Not sure where you will find it on the internet. A flyer collector friend of mine has it. Also, in the game's manual the board is referred to as the Crystal System. If you go into any PCB shop in Japan, they will call it the same. Pictures of anything written on the carts would be great, also a complete list of your games for the system (Enha didn't know Topblade V is a Zealer Board game, for example). You're not equipped to capture good screenshots by any chance, are you? What is referred to as Topblade V is actually known as Beyblade in Japan and the West. I've since sold that game to a local arcade. Herongi which is the Korean title for Herohero-kun in Japan is also on the same format. Cutey Fatty is also on this platform. Only the Brezzasoft developed games have actual cart shells, all of the Korean games are PCB only. I am building a screenshot box right now but having trouble finding a slim case to support a mini-ITX mobo with Micomsoft's SC card. The idea is to make a very portable box to take around to my gaming setups.
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