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Post by Null0x00 on Sept 26, 2017 2:58:02 GMT -5
Flappy Bird for #1, plz.
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Post by nerdybat on Sept 30, 2017 8:10:15 GMT -5
Despite the fact that I both like Pokemon as a series and don't mind when the games I love don't get very high in the list, ranking for Pokemon was a little too ridiculous in my opinion. Basically, a lot of arguments about historical importance and staying power of the franchise, but barely any mention of the actual gameplay of Red & Blue, which is, frankly, kind of a mess - I mean, the balance is all over the place, there's at least one easily accessable possibility to get into unwinnable state, you can abuse the hell out of it with the right tricks (and not in intended TES-like way), and some types don't even work properly (there are no weaknesses for psychic types due to a bug, as far as I know). Giving a top-tier spot to such a severely unpolished and obsolete game was kinda weird, imo. I think in that partiuclar case, while we all agreed the game itself had issues, that wasn't why we ranked it so high. There's been quite a few times when we've rated games that high just because they were that important and that influential. I don't need to go into how much of a big deal Pokemon was, and just how important it was for a lot of reasons. We go into the same sort of reasoning with Bejeweled. That game is also pretty dull, but it's also so incredibly important that not giving it a high ranking just wouldn't feel right. I actually kinda agree with this point of view, but I think there also should be some limits regarding game's popularity/importance vs. actual playability. Games like Super Mario 64 or Doom, while severely outdated compared to some contemporaries, deserve the place way up on the list due to still being incredibly polished, cohesive and fun to play. Same with SMB1 - it's fine to put it in the 1st place, because original SMB is still pretty damn fun and polished for what it is. Pokemon 1st gen, on the other hand, is a genuinely rough and unpolished game with some mechanics that just don't work and some glitches that can permanently ruin the cartridge. After all, HG101 gang already lowballed several games on basis of "Not being well-designed despite having a great idea and importance in the industry" (Goldeneye 007, as a mild example), so while I respect the decision (I'm not the one to decide after all  ), it's a bit inconsistent to see original Pokemon being ranked that high despite a crapton of flaws. Considering the arguments made during the episode, I'm surprised it found its place above Doom - sure, Pokemon created the craze and popularized the genre, but Doom did the same thing with one of the most popular genres to this very day, and it has arguably more noticeable legacy behind it (from creating modding culture as we know it, to being the modern "Hello World" of porting projects). If basing the list on importance and influence, with all respect, I fail to see how Pokemon is more important and influental than Doom. |
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Napoli
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Post by Napoli on Oct 2, 2017 9:58:38 GMT -5
There is no way Pokemon should have ended up above Doom. First Person Shooters as a genre is way more important than the monster collecting sub-genre of RPGs that Pokemon popularized. Then there is the multiplayer aspect of Doom which was hugely important for PC gaming. I don't really understand the placement of Pokemon either.
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Napoli
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Post by Napoli on Oct 2, 2017 10:12:46 GMT -5
And I just left a 5 star review on iTunes. Can we please get Ys Book I and II for the Turbo CD reviewed soon. This should without a doubt be a top 20 game.
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Post by Bumpyroad on Oct 2, 2017 11:29:51 GMT -5
This should without a doubt be a top 20 game. The list is greatly affected by platforms and ports, so i wouldn't be so sure. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2017 11:34:10 GMT -5
Is the Turbo CD release generally considered to be the best version of the first two games?
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Post by backgroundnoise on Oct 2, 2017 11:45:20 GMT -5
I got the impression that that either the PC Engine or PSP/Windows version are considered the best (then again, I've seen arguments in favour of the Saturn version as well). As much as I like the games, I don't see them scoring all that high (bellow Felghana, at least) considering that Hydlide styled combat isn't exactly looked upon fondly.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2017 12:12:51 GMT -5
It's kind of significant from a historical perspective in its use of anime cut scenes and voice acting, plus the music. You're right, though. Probably won't score too highly, but I tend to prefer the stuff that gets clumped in the middle.
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Napoli
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Post by Napoli on Oct 2, 2017 15:47:01 GMT -5
It's kind of significant from a historical perspective in its use of anime cut scenes and voice acting, plus the music. You're right, though. Probably won't score too highly, but I tend to prefer the stuff that gets clumped in the middle. It's extremely significant. I think EGM giving it a 10 says a lot about the quality of the game at the time. The game was arguably the first CD game of any significance. I remember the game wowing myself and my friends when we first played it. The game still holds up really well and is definitely one of the best games of the 16-bit generation. |
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Post by kal on Oct 4, 2017 4:08:47 GMT -5
While we tried to make it clear (or at least I did) I very much felt like the Pokemon ranking was for Pokemon R&B and Pokemon as a franchise, my reasoning was and remains that Pokemon merely required polish to be *better* and is essentially the same game going on 20+ years strong. Which not even CoD can attest to and yes it's likely we would have to rank at least one COD very high given how the numbers add up. I also really don't want to have to look at another Pokemon game, separating those games out really feels like splitting hairs.
The Ys's games will be added when we do a review sweep although we still have several other review requests to go. I find the interesting stuff gets into the middle because in order to be interesting it usually makes someone not like it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 11:23:53 GMT -5
The Ys's games will be added when we do a review sweep although we still have several other review requests to go. I find the interesting stuff gets into the middle because in order to be interesting it usually makes someone not like it. Night Trap should have been much, much higher. |
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Post by eatersthemanfool on Oct 4, 2017 22:34:54 GMT -5
Night Trap for #1!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 22:42:28 GMT -5
#2, at least. It would be a very knowing wink to the game's notoriety.
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Post by toei on Oct 5, 2017 15:04:30 GMT -5
I got the impression that that either the PC Engine or PSP/Windows version are considered the best (then again, I've seen arguments in favour of the Saturn version as well). As much as I like the games, I don't see them scoring all that high (bellow Felghana, at least) considering that Hydlide styled combat isn't exactly looked upon fondly. Ys did it well, though, wherehas NES Hydlide didn't. I love it, myself; no wasting time bashing enemies over and over like in Ys 7, you just literally run through enemies, leveling up in seconds. It's beautiful. |
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Post by kal on Oct 9, 2017 21:50:47 GMT -5
The Ys's games will be added when we do a review sweep although we still have several other review requests to go. I find the interesting stuff gets into the middle because in order to be interesting it usually makes someone not like it. Night Trap should have been much, much higher. Believe you me, if I had my way it'd have been embarrassingly high but alas. Also sadly we did it before the anniversary re-release which greatly improves the game so that's a bother. Still Night Trap is awesome and a mandatory play. |
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), it's a bit inconsistent to see original Pokemon being ranked that high despite a crapton of flaws. Considering the arguments made during the episode, I'm surprised it found its place above Doom - sure, Pokemon created the craze and popularized the genre, but Doom did the same thing with one of the most popular genres to this very day, and it has arguably more noticeable legacy behind it (from creating modding culture as we know it, to being the modern "Hello World" of porting projects). If basing the list on importance and influence, with all respect, I fail to see how Pokemon is more important and influental than Doom.
