|
Post by jackcaeylin on Apr 14, 2021 2:31:17 GMT -5
I like these hybridization segments. Denjin Makai 2 (Arcade) as well as Bayonetta had shooting segments, if you want get score for 1 UP or points, if you want to unlock movesets. I don't mind hidden hybrdization moments even if they are hidden and can be missed in a regular gameplay like at Metal Gear Solid 2 with its skate-boarding.
|
|
|
Post by elektrolurch on Apr 14, 2021 3:08:50 GMT -5
I don't know if that counts but- what about modern meta games were the prime focus is about changing genre and gameplay examples all the time? The Hex is the first thing that came to my mind, where you play another genre each segment of the game, in very unexpected ways....
Also.....it was pretty common with licensed games on home computers in the 90ies and late 80ies- Back to the Future 2 and,to a lesser extent, Terminator 2 for amiga did this,for instance. In the first case,each level was something else......
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2021 3:59:11 GMT -5
I don't know if that counts but- what about modern meta games were the prime focus is about changing genre and gameplay examples all the time? The Hex is the first thing that came to my mind, where you play another genre each segment of the game, in very unexpected ways.... I think a game like that is pretty hard to pull off, but an understanding of the end user is important. Generally even in these cases I think keeping the game easy is best to keep the game entertaining throughout. Of course it helps if the marketing gives an idea the genre will shift throughout, which can be communicated without spoiling all the surprises of course. As for old licensed games - many Batman games had Batmobile sections of course. Also, for some reason in the SNES Batman Returns there are sidescrolling levels where your sole attack becomes the batarang. Those were a bit strange, and not as good (imo) as the beat em up gameplay, however they were similar enough to feel like they belonged and didn't steal too much focus.
|
|
|
Post by elektrolurch on Apr 14, 2021 6:43:07 GMT -5
How could i forget... Frog Fractions, the game that kinda "invented" this kind of unexpected switching of genres and mechanics in a modern sense.
|
|
|
Post by dsparil on Apr 14, 2021 9:41:37 GMT -5
Although something like Evoland II shows the peril in shifting in too many different directions. There's an hour or two of legitimately good top down Zelda clone buried inside ten hours of absolute garbage . The first one doesn't even have any bright spots as it vacillates between mediocre Zelda clone and awful Final Fantasy clone, but at least it's short!
|
|
|
Post by shelverton on Apr 14, 2021 10:37:47 GMT -5
Ni No Kuni II tries a couple of things: There are real time strategy battles that happen every once in a while and they were my least favorite thing in the entire game. You can’t really skip these either if you wanna have a reasonable chance of finishing the game.
There’s also the town building that works pretty much like your average smart phone town building app. Lots of waiting...
I would’ve cut all these things out and instead put more effort in the JRPG part of the game, which certainly looks AAA but ultimately feels like a much lower budget game. It was a very strange and oddly charmless experience for me.
|
|
|
Post by windfisch on Apr 15, 2021 4:41:35 GMT -5
Although something like Evoland II shows the peril in shifting in too many different directions. There's an hour or two of legitimately good top down Zelda clone buried inside ten hours of absolute garbage . Agreed. Evoland II is the first thing that comes to mind when talking about poorly done all-in-one games. The Zelda portions weren't that great either, imo, but still the best part. I also think the Shining Force and Chrono Trigger sections were kinda okay, albeit pretty barebones and a bit too long. So right there we have already three and a half types of Zelda plus turn-base RPG and tactics. Any sane person would've stopped at the Zelda parts, those are hard enough to get right in the first place. Why they felt the need to also add shoot 'em up-, beat 'em up- and fighting game- and whatever-random-genre-they could come up-with-sections, is beyond me. Those are so sloppily done that they really drag down what could've been an uninspired, yet decent game. It was was pretty buggy, too - another sign that the devs lacked skill, resources and most of all humility to match their ambitions.
|
|
|
Post by phediuk on Apr 15, 2021 5:09:26 GMT -5
Ultima I has to be the oldest example. About 75% of the way through the way you get a spaceship and then the game becomes a first-person shmup in the vein of Star Raiders for awhile.
|
|
|
Post by ommadawnyawn2 on Apr 15, 2021 5:30:35 GMT -5
005 is another 1981 example, switching to side view for the chopper escape segments: www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z34HiNofsLgFrom 1982 there's Zoo Keeper and Monster Bash, and from 1983 there's Survival Island and Major Havoc.
|
|
|
Post by dr_st on Apr 15, 2021 12:44:46 GMT -5
My experience is rather positive with games that have a consistent style/genre, and use unique gameplay segments to "spice things up". Generally, if well-done, it works well for me to prevent it from becoming repetitive. For example, in the aforementioned Rayman 3, I rather enjoyed the sliding segments, the flying, and even the shoe was OK most of the time. Rayman 3 for the GBA, which was mostly a 2D platformer, also had a few driving segments (a-la Mario Kart), which were OK.
What I don't like is when the "side mechanic" is so frequently used, that it itself becomes repetitive, because then it draws to much from the main game, and it is also usually not as fun (because it was developed as a side-project, not a main thing). The worst example I can think of is those godawful "pipe-flow hacking" sessions in Bioshock. I think it really contributed to my general dislike of this game (and yes, I know, they can mostly be skipped after some point).
A lot of games put these different-style segments in the form of side-quests / minigames so that it does not detract from the main game. I think this is the best approach. Again, in Rayman 3, there were 9-10 different mini-games, with distinct styles, some of them just expanded section of side-mechanics (like flying the hovercraft or navigating a rocket). Mortal Kombat (2011) had those "test your might/sight/strike/luck stuff" in the challenge tower.
Now, if it is about games having a consistent style, which changes at some point into something else - then I cannot off the top of my head remember a single game like this. However, open-world games with missions, like the Grand Theft Auto series, (especially once it moved into 3D), tend to offer a good variety of different-style mechanics that still feel consistent in the game. You have melee and gun fights, sniping jobs, stealth missions, speed-driving missions, races in all sorts of vehicles, etc. Many of these could be used to fill a game on their own (though probably not a long one like GTA). Now I'm playing through the 2003 classic - Beyond Good and Evil - and it shares many similar themes. The Chronicles of Riddick series is a bit like this too, although it uses a select few themes more heavily - most of the time you are either in stealth or in full-out gun action.
|
|
|
Post by toei on Apr 20, 2021 3:55:31 GMT -5
If we're talking about games where the core gameplay switches to a different genre for certain segment, and not games where the core gameplay is an hybrid of different genres (though as usual when trying to define things, there are many examples that make the distinction a bit fuzzy), one of the only games to do it well is Vice: Project Doom, with both the top-down driving and the gallery shooter sequences actually being decent. Even then, though, the side-scrolling that makes up most of the game is clearly better.
In general I find that this is one of those ideas that sounds great on paper but almost never turns out well, for the already mentioned reason that every genre you add on multiplies the amount of work, knowledge/experience and talent required to get the basics right, and getting the basics right is the most important part.
If we're talking about true hybrids, though, I love when games mix VS fighter combat with RPG exploration. Tobal's Quest Modes, Shaolin on the PSX, even Abalaburn ended up playable for me despite the fundamentally bad fighting engine. In order for it to work, though, you can't have random encounters. Even then, the promise of that particular hybrid genre has never been quite fulfilled.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 4:48:46 GMT -5
toei - yeah I was looking for examples of the former. With regard to actual hybrids I think there are a lot of great ones around. I don't think I ever played a vs fighter with RPG exploration though so that's a new one on me. dr_st I think open world games such as GTA would come under a hybrid. All different elements of gameplay come together to form the sandbox. Even though different missions have different gimmicks and gameplay focuses you're not going outside of the core experience offered.
|
|
|
Post by Woody Alien on Apr 20, 2021 6:04:04 GMT -5
TvTropes to the rescue: tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnexpectedGameplayChangeA thing I noticed is that in the 90s there were several 2D action side-scrollers/platformers that for one stage turned into a horizontal shmup, for example Dynamite Headdy, Superfrog, etc. A recent game that imitates violent brawlers and platformers from that era, Insanity's Blade, does this as well. Suburban Commando, the game that adapted the Hulk Hogan movie of the same name, starts with a shmup level and continues as a platformer for the rest of the levels, with boss fights made to look like a 1-vs-1 fighting game (but are actually just like the platforming sections again, and thus barely playable).
|
|
|
Post by dsparil on Apr 20, 2021 8:00:59 GMT -5
Having a shooter section is one of those things that seems to pop up all the time. Monster Boy has one too although it's a genre the developers have worked in.
A few other (non-shooter) ones:
Legend's Mission Critical has an RTS mini-game that pops up twice that is super complicated but very short and completely skippable. You have to go through a full RTS's worth of tutorials for two "missions" that last minutes. I suspect there was some kind of sharing with Star Control III that lead to it.
Mikhail gets a kingdom ruling and RTS mini-game in Romancing Saga 3. I'd say they're fairly well developed overall but still a minor element overall.
The fact that combat didn't get cut from the first Zork in the move from the mainframe version is just odd. There's only two required fights with a third having a peaceful solution. Your score is supposedly a proxy for experience, but the troll near the beginning is super easy and might die in one hit while the thief should be dealt with ASAP and still might die very quickly. There's so much text devoted to it which could have been put to better use elsewhere. Zork III does somewhat make it more justifiable in hindsight, but that game was almost entirely new material.
|
|
|
Post by Snake on Apr 20, 2021 18:29:49 GMT -5
Golgo 13:Top Secret Episode/Twilight of the Gods - Lots of shifts, pauses, breaks, and such in the gameplay style!
Side-scrolling platform jumping, kicking, gun shooting. POV - Shooting sequences Helicopter side scrolling shooter Cut-scenes and hotel love making Scuba adventure shooter Dungeon crawling. Rinse and repeat till the final battle!
|
|