Top influential games... on the games you like

[ommadawnyawn2]

These lists tend to be predictable as there's generally a correlation between most popular and most influential, and it's rare for something like a new or forgotten developer interview to come up that changes our perspective on game history.

A list of obscure games is naturally more interesting as it goes back to the innovative games that (potentially) influenced the streamlining, popularizing games, but also tends to get speculative.


I thought we could do a topic where we list games that inspired the games we like, followed by an explanation, to make it more personal and perhaps surprising. Below is mine, mostly with wikipedia or mainstream articles as sources but with some speculation thrown in here and there.



1970s:
Colossal Cave Adventure (PDP-10, 1976/1977) - Adventure, Rogue

Star Raiders (Atari 8-bit, 1979) - Elite, Solaris, Star Luster->Star Fox 2, Wing Commander->X-Wing

​Space Invaders (ARC, 1978) - Galaxian->Galaga->Scramble (and Defender)->Xevious, etc.

​Western Gun/Gun Fight (ARC, 1975) - Robotron 2084, Twin stick gameplay

​Akalabeth (PCs, 1979) - Its success led to the Ultima series

Superman (Atari 2600, 1979) - Not sure but it has various interesting firsts like open world gameplay, object manipulation, a looping world, thieving enemies, friendly NPCs, transformations, not being able to die and shortcuts


1980s:
Quest For Glory I: So You Want To Be A Hero (PC, 1989) - Merging contemporary adventure games' interactive dialogue w/ RPG conventions and an open world w/ avoidable encounters. This and Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade (PC, 1989)'s dialogue trees seem to have had the most impact on changing later WRPGs.

Adventure (Atari 2600, 1980) - Led to Dragon Slayer (PC-88/PC-98/FM-7/X1, 1984) which combined it with Sokoban, and that in turn led to Zelda 1 (with some additional influence from Ultima and Black Onyx)

Ultima IV (Multi, 1985/C64, 1986/AMI, 1988) - Also pivotal in making RPGs interesting

Tempest (ARC, 1981) - Buck Rogers, Major Havoc and Gyruss which then led to Space Harrier, After Burner, Galaxy Force II, etc.

Super Mario Bros. (1985) and Mega Man (1987) - Better platformers and action platformers

Knightmare II: Maze of Galious (MSX, 1987) - CV2, possibly Wonder Boy 3 and/or Zillion, La-Mulana

Starflight (PC (1986/MD, 1991) - Star Control 1-2, Mass Effect, Dwarf Fortress

Laser Squad (Spectrum/C64, 1988/AMI, 1989/PC, 1992) - X-COM (via Civilization and Populous)->Fallout

Thunder Force II (X68K, 1988/MD, 1989) and Zanac/Zanac EX (MSX, 1986) - Their success helped lead to more accessible and fun shoot 'em ups like the Aleste series, Gun Nac, Elemental Master, rest of the TF series, Hyper Duel and the of Thunder games, plus the hybrids Guardian Legend and Golvellius

Populous (PCs, 1989/SMS, 1991) - SimCity 2000 and Powermonger, X-COM's perspective
Aztec (Apple II, 1982/Multi) - Plays similarly to Karateka and Prince of Persia
Choplifter (PCs, 1982/ARC, 1985/SMS, 1986) - Jackal and Desert Strike but also Rescue Raiders->Herzog 1
Knight Lore (PCs, 1984/FDS, 1986) - Solstice, D/Generation, Landstalker, Light Crusader, Mario RPG, Dark Savior, Alundra 2
Military Madness/Nectaris (PCE, 1989) - Langrisser, Dune II
SimCity (AMI/PC, 1989) - Dune II, Warcraft, Caesar series
Kid Kool (NES, 1988) and ​Psycho Fox (SMS, 1989) - Sonic the Hedgehog (acceleration style, multiple routes, water skipping, springs, anthropomorphic player char)


1990s:
King's Bounty (PC, 1990/MD, 1991) and Master of Magic (PC, 1994) - Heroes of Might and Magic series

Dune II: The Building of a Dynasty (PC, 1992/AMI, 1993/MD, 1993) - Warcaft series, C&C series, Lords of the Realm 1-2, Total Annihilation

Ultima Underworld: The Stygian Abyss (PC, 1992) - System Shock 1-2, Elder Scrolls 2: Daggerfall, Deus Ex, Bioshock, Half-Life 2, Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines, (and ES1, Tomb Raider, Arx Fatalis, Gears of War)

Star Control II (PC, 1992) - Fallout, Mass Effect, Stellaris

Civilization (PC, 1991) - Dune II, X-COM, Master of Magic->HoM&M, Age of Empires

Power Monger/Powermonger (AMI, 1990/PC, 1991/MD/FMT, 1992/SNES, 1993/MCD, 1994) - Magic Carpet->Dungeon Keeper and Populous 3

Another World (AMI/PC/MD, 1991/PC Remake, ) - Flashback, Ico, Limbo, influenced Kojima and Suda
Lemmings (AMI, 1991/SMS, 1992) - Warcraft, Ico
Super Mario 64 (N64, 1996) and Tomb Raider (PS1/SAT/PC, 1996) - 3D TP view action games
Catacomb 3D (PC, 1991) - Wolf3D->Doom->Powerslave/Exhumed and Strife
Earthbound/Mother 2 (SNES, 1994) - Good writing and satire in JRPGs, Mother 3
Kaeru no Tame ni Kane wa Naru/For the Frog the Bell Tolls (GB, 1992) - Zelda: Link's Awakening
Beatmania (ARC, 1997) - Guitar Hero, Elite Beat Agents
Theme Park (PC/AMI/3DO, 1994/MD/MCD/SNES, 1995) - Dungeon Keeper, Theme Hospital
Outcast (PC, 1999) - Not sure but it pioneered various things that became more standard in the '00s or even '10s: High degree of interactivity in a detailed and open-ended 3D environment, fully voiced NPCs, good quest log, systemic elements like weakening enemy patrols via their supply chains, more natural NPC behavior, detailed and zoomable mini-map, etc.
Virtua Fighter (ARC, 1993) - Major influence on the 3D focus of the PS1, Tomb Raider, Quake
Radia Senki: Reimeihen (Chronicle of the Radia War)/Tower of Radia (NES, 1991) - FF Adventure predates it by about half a year but it seems to have influenced SoM


2000s: 
I'll have to think about it some more!

[excelsior]

You do ask the tough questions omma. I'll try and think of more but I'll post a few from the top of my head. Perhaps you can fill some of the gaps in.


Ultima Underworld > King's Field Series

                           > System Shock 1&2 > Metroid Prime > Bioshock


Robotron > Geometry Wars > Nex Machina


Sweet Home & Alone in the Dark > Resident Evil Series > Luigi's Mansion series


Various RTS games > Pikmin > Little King's Story


Legend of Zelda & Skyrim > Breath of the Wild

[ommadawnyawn2]

Cool, what would you say is your fave King's Field?

Didn't think of that connection for Luigi's Mansion before but it makes sense now that you mention it!

[Snake]

Super Mario Bros seems to be the given progenitor to modern platformers.  Maybe before that, "Pitfall!"

With that game as a base, Konami took characters from their main franchises: Konami Man, Konami Lady, Simon Belmont (Castlevania), King Kong (King Kong 2), Mikey (The Goonies/Goonies 2), Goemon, Moai-head (Moai/Gradius), Fuma (Getsufuma-den), Twinbee, Vic Viper (Gradius/Salamander), and mashed it into an all-in-one action adventure platformer + scrolling shooter game. Konami Wai Wai World.

[ommadawnyawn2]

That reminds me there's a camera centering hack for Wai Wai World that I should try.

For pre-SMB platformers (besides the two I mentioned), I'm partial towards Montezuma's Revenge. Major Havoc is pretty cool but very tough. Jumpman seems pretty creative too.

[excelsior]

Jun 16, 2022 8:22:46 GMT -5 ommadawnyawn2 said:

Cool, what would you say is your fave King's Field?

The fourth game. I think the extra power of the PS2 helped with the world building and atmosphere. I love all of them though.

[Snake]

Jun 16, 2022 16:35:29 GMT -5 ommadawnyawn2 said:

That reminds me there's a camera centering hack for Wai Wai World that I should try.

For pre-SMB platformers (besides the two I mentioned), I'm partial towards Montezuma's Revenge. Major Havoc is pretty cool but very tough. Jumpman seems pretty creative too.

Interesting!

Did not know there was a Jumpman game, I had to look it up.  On that note, before Mario was "Mario," (taking the name of Nintendo of America's landlord in Washington state) he was "Jump Man" in Donkey Kong... July 1981!  Meanwhile, looks like Pitfall! is a 1982 game.  


As point-and-click adventure games go, I really like Leisure Suit Larry 5 and 6, and Full Throttle.  But which game is the first?  Is there something that pre-dates the first King's Quest?

[dsparil]

To be pedantic, King's Quest is a graphical adventure but not a point and click one since it uses a parser. The first graphical adventure is considered to be Sierra's Mystery House in 1980. For an actual point and click game, the model is basically Maniac Mansion. There's earlier Mac games that use a mouse, the earliest is Enchanted Scepters, but those are first person.

[ommadawnyawn2]

Jun 17, 2022 12:06:21 GMT -5 Snake said:

Jun 16, 2022 16:35:29 GMT -5 ommadawnyawn2 said:

That reminds me there's a camera centering hack for Wai Wai World that I should try.

For pre-SMB platformers (besides the two I mentioned), I'm partial towards Montezuma's Revenge. Major Havoc is pretty cool but very tough. Jumpman seems pretty creative too.

Interesting!

Did not know there was a Jumpman game, I had to look it up.  On that note, before Mario was "Mario," (taking the name of Nintendo of America's landlord in Washington state) he was "Jump Man" in Donkey Kong... July 1981!  Meanwhile, looks like Pitfall! is a 1982 game.  


As point-and-click adventure games go, I really like Leisure Suit Larry 5 and 6, and Full Throttle.  But which game is the first?  Is there something that pre-dates the first King's Quest?

Haha oh yeah, I forgot Mario was called that before Jumpman the game. The Pitfall games aren't bad either. 

I believe the first popular point & click-style ones are Maniac Mansion as mentioned, and Deja Vu (Mac & Amiga versions). It Came From the Desert was also fairly early and pretty unique, but more of a hybrid action and horror game. 

Edit:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=53ZYbCUSlgc&t=15m12s
Apparently that's the first P&C one. 

[dsparil]

It gets a little trickier to figure out the first one if you consider adventure games with a parser versus ones that don't have a parser. That actually ends up dropping Enchanted Scepters because it isn't fully command based. There's also an even earlier Japanese trilogy, Legends of Star Arthur or alternatively Star Arthur Legends, which started in July 1983 that is possible the first command-based adventure game. However, that also had a parser although it might been completely optional. The first 100% command-based game might even be Sierra's Mickey's Space Adventure! That's a 1984 game, and I don't remember it taking text input at all when I played it a few years ago.

Al Lowe also made a few games for children based around multiple choice options that are even older. The first, Dragon's Keep, is from 1982. An old CGW review, positive for reference, notes that it's for second graders so it's not exactly that complicated but it is an adventure game. What makes Dragon's Keep interesting is that it's such an early game from someone that was also a genre luminary and obscure but not forgotten. You can download his earliest games from his website so they're not exactly hard to track down. I'd argue that they merge together all the possible command/object possibilities not that there's ever that many. It should be clear that I have a fascination with DK! It along with the more directly educational Bop-a-bet and DK follow up Troll's Tale got Sierra's attention and they brought him on board to work on children's games. DK and Troll's Tale are so important to gaming history and they get basically no recognition.

[ommadawnyawn2]

Cool, I wish there was an adaption of the Way of the Tiger books like that (DK).

[Snake]

Jun 17, 2022 18:00:42 GMT -5 dsparil said:

The first 100% command-based game might even be Sierra's Mickey's Space Adventure! That's a 1984 game, and I don't remember it taking text input at all when I played it a few years ago.

Interesting! Didnt' even know Sierra made a Mickey game!  

[dsparil]

Jun 20, 2022 19:34:45 GMT -5 Snake said:

Jun 17, 2022 18:00:42 GMT -5 dsparil said:

The first 100% command-based game might even be Sierra's Mickey's Space Adventure! That's a 1984 game, and I don't remember it taking text input at all when I played it a few years ago.

Interesting! Didnt' even know Sierra made a Mickey game!  

Disney partnered with Sierra for a few years in the 80s. They made Donald Duck's Playground (mini-game collection), Winnie the Pooh in the Hundred Acre Woods (collect-a-thon), Mickey's Space Adventure (simple adventure), and an adaption of The Black Cauldron (adventure). BC is interesting too because it's the first full adventure game designed by Al Lowe and where the Two Guys from Andromeda first met!

[Snake]

That's really cool! I forgot that The Black Cauldron even existed! I need to go back and rewatch it. 


Pretty good breadth of material on Al Lowe, to go from making licensed Disney games to Leisure Suit Larry some King's Quest!