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Post by dsparil on Jun 16, 2024 5:24:09 GMT -5
The PSX doesn't have hardware support for perspective texture transformations which only makes things look even weirder.
I genuinely do like Warped, but the first two Crash games are not good. It also doesn't help that the N.Sane Trilogy has such fundamental issues with jumping. I remember the developers going on and on about the lengths they went to recreate the games only to mess up was is literally the most basic element.
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Post by JDarkside on Jun 16, 2024 7:02:46 GMT -5
That remaster collection also had terrible art design, especially when you compare it to what Toys for Bob would do in Crash 4. I've had trouble clicking with Crash as well, something about the camera made it just feel wrong to me. I think I could adjust if I wanted, but since the series is owned by Activision now, that killed any desire to.
On the flip side, I really like the open gameplay of stuff like Mario 64 and Banjo-Kazooie, especially when a game has tight move tech going on. Demon Turf really impressed me with how high the skill ceiling could get, but I started to wane on it when the snake mode was introduced that makes you go really fast in one direction. Fun to use but also very difficult to get used to when it came to how it turns and such.
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Post by Apollo Chungus on Jun 16, 2024 15:20:23 GMT -5
I don't really consider Mega Man Legends as a 3D platformer, but more of an action-RPG with its big focus on story, dungeon crawling and sense of adventure. I think having a different perspective on genres can be helpful to better understanding why a game does or doesn't work for you or other people; I used to dislike Psychonauts loads, and then came to realize (largely through the video B-Mask did on it) that it's basically an adventure game wearing the guise of a platformer, and to appreciate its focus on weird puzzles, talking to people, and having all kinds of things to discover or not depending on how you wanna interact with it.
I'm the opposite on the original Crash Bandicoot trilogy, where I think the first game is the best, the second's quite good and Warped is kinda naff. 2 and Warped have easier stages for sure, but I love the original's sense of progression and find the various minigame stages in Warped to range from tedious to intolerable. Twinsanity's still my favourite though, in spite of how buggy and truncated it is.
I suppose apart from Legends (and Battle Network), Mega Man in general is a series I don't really "get" the appeal of, but that's because I'm not into action games that test your reflexes and ability to repeat stages/bosses until you get the one tricky bit down - 2D ones especially, since you have less margin for error compared to 3D games. I prefer 3D platformers in general partially because they tend to be more generous, and usually tended to focus on big worlds where you take your time exploring, encountering characters and having big adventures without having your skills tested so much. Granted, I grew up with 3D platformers and I find a kinship with them for letting me vicariously adventure when I wasn't and aren't able to do so in my own life, so of course I'm gonna feel that way.
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Post by JDarkside on Jun 16, 2024 16:29:37 GMT -5
Ah yes, a fellow B-Mask enjoyer.
I think platformers have their own pros and cons in 2D and 3D, but the indie scene has really started to blur the line with 3D ones. While those often had some strong skill tech, focus was more point on collecting and giving the player a lot to do and see. There's been an increased focus with indie 3D platformers to create more challenging tests of skill with move tech, to the point that they brought back the Mario 64 wall jump, which has been heavily simplified into scripted little bits to break up levels in major releases, and increased the complexity of it to allow a lot more movement opportunities and reward experimentation. You can actually use the wall jump in Demon Turf to ignore entire obstacle courses, and it's really fun to pull off.
Just sort of thinking out loud on this topic, btw, I don't think I've nailed down my taste with platformers besides I do not like die a million times Super Meat Boy style experiences, but do enjoy a good Mega Man that's on the easier end of the spectrum for those games (ala 7 or 8).
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Post by lurker on Jun 16, 2024 20:54:08 GMT -5
Didn't the Crash remasters also have weird hitbox changes?
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Post by dsparil on Jun 17, 2024 3:14:18 GMT -5
Crash having a pill shaped rather than rectangular hitbox was the speculation. That fits what I experienced. You'd miss jumps that would land in the original from a smaller hitbox, you'd slide off edges if you got too close to them from its rounded edges, and you also move forward slightly when landing even when jumping straight up because of the collision detection. The official explanation was because all three games had their physics based on Warped's. That doesn't really explain anything, but at the same time, Warped didn't have those problems as much if at all.
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Post by retr0gamer on Jun 17, 2024 5:01:21 GMT -5
It was the pill shaped hit box. The PlayStation wouldn't have had the CPU power to calculate a pill shaped hit box. They did fix things up with updates but it still had you slide off edges when you thought you'd made a jump. I don't think a hit box change could have made crash 1 good though.
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Post by excelsior on Jun 17, 2024 5:10:25 GMT -5
Sorry, I don't usually do this in my threads but I want to redirect the discussion because I think talk of technicalities of the Crash remake is off topic. I'm going to forward another one, still within the 3D space that was a cult game at best and that is Mirror's Edge. That game in my opinion really exposes the limitations of the first person perspective in video games. The awareness of our surroundings is judged entirely on the field of vision granted by the game and therefore I just found it impossible to know my positioning in relation to the platforms. Without the benefit of other senses and freedom of natural bodily movement I find the game to be conceptually flawed. Yet, some people swear by it and I really don't grasp that.
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Post by Apollo Chungus on Jun 18, 2024 9:00:11 GMT -5
Ooh, I got one! The very original Outrun. I love Outrun 2 and its various incarnations (Coast 2 Coast, 2SP, etc.), and I quite enjoyed what little I played of Outrunners on the Mega Drive, but that original arcade game's never resonated with me. It's got excellent music and it's always great to have a game that focused on the thrill of driving through cool places, I just don't enjoy playing it. I can never get past the second area, whichever route I take, before running out of time. I've always wondered if maybe there's something in the mechanics that I'm missing, like how I used to not understand the benefit of drifting in Outrun 2. Even on stuff like the 3DS port where you can give yourself as much time as possible, it never works out and I still run out of time, baffled by how much I don't get anything from it.
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Post by spanky on Jun 18, 2024 12:27:27 GMT -5
If I'm being completely honest here I've always found myself very lukewarm over Sega's classic arcade games in general. Not that I don't like them - I do, it's just that their fans absolutely LOVE them and I'm just not seeing what they see.
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Post by retr0gamer on Jun 19, 2024 2:35:10 GMT -5
Ooh, I got one! The very original Outrun. I love Outrun 2 and its various incarnations (Coast 2 Coast, 2SP, etc.), and I quite enjoyed what little I played of Outrunners on the Mega Drive, but that original arcade game's never resonated with me. It's got excellent music and it's always great to have a game that focused on the thrill of driving through cool places, I just don't enjoy playing it. I can never get past the second area, whichever route I take, before running out of time. I've always wondered if maybe there's something in the mechanics that I'm missing, like how I used to not understand the benefit of drifting in Outrun 2. Even on stuff like the 3DS port where you can give yourself as much time as possible, it never works out and I still run out of time, baffled by how much I don't get anything from it. Outrun is just a tough game. If you crash once you aren't getting past that second area.
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Post by nightdreamer on Jun 19, 2024 5:57:01 GMT -5
Oh I got another one. Marvel vs Capcom 2. The game is absolutely fine, one of the best fighting games of all time, no question. What I really don't get is why the love for that godawful elevator music. I hated them when I first heard them, and I hate them even more now because they've become unavoidable and you're pretty much guaranteed to hear them if you consume videogame youtube content. Pls make it stop!
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Post by dsparil on Jun 19, 2024 6:33:06 GMT -5
When I first played MvC2 at a friend's house, I thought it was some bootleg copy that had all the music replaced!
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Post by Digitalnametag on Jun 19, 2024 17:09:16 GMT -5
"I wanna take you for a ride" does sound like something an elevator would do. I must admit that I love the cheesiness of the soundtrack though.
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Post by JDarkside on Jun 19, 2024 17:25:14 GMT -5
Yeah, it's just so goofy that it's hard not to vibe with it on some level. I would say it's mostly memes but no, the sound does have a unique, chinsy style to it that works in how unexpected it is and the overall menu style of the game. It would also fit really well in a Dreamcast exclusive, like ChuChu Rocket or something like that, that sort of turn of the millennium, technobubble and white vibe.
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