|
|
Post by zzz on Sept 25, 2007 4:59:32 GMT -5
ALL doujin games are technically amateur commercial releases. Games made by amateurs, but still sold. If it is freeware, then it is just called freeware.
|
|
|
|
Post by dai jou bu on Sept 25, 2007 12:42:27 GMT -5
ALL doujin games are technically amateur commercial releases. Games made by amateurs, but still sold. If it is freeware, then it is just called freeware. Not true. The major websites that cover doujin games also group freeware titles made by Japanese people into this category. "Publish" does not always equate to "you can only have these if you pay me money or trade me something of equivalent value in return." No, there's quite a lot that are free. Kenta Cho is a good example. So what exactly makes Tsukihime considered doujin and Fate/Stay commercial, distribution channels? What about the related Melty Blood? As I understand it, the earlier pc editions are considered doujin while the arcade, PS2, and pc versions of Act Cadenza are commercial. Is that right? Short answer: Yes. I'm just curious as to where the line is drawn. Here's the long answer: The line between doujin and commercial (I should be using shougyou for this one, but I'm lazy) is very, very fine. The doujin community can also be seen as a place for people to get their feet wet in making their hobby a full-time career, as commercial parties also look here for aspiring talent they can use to help make them more money. CLAMP was originally a doujin circle before they went professional, for example. And even when these people do move on to professional careers, they still may return here because they can produce works that would've been impossible to make in the commercial world because their publisher may not approve of it. The same thing happened with Type-Moon: they were originally a doujin circle when they released Tsukihime. It sold a lot for a doujin release, convincing them that they were good enough to go pro, which they did four years later after the first game was released. Since French-Bread was also a doujin circle who was well known at the time for making really polished fighting games, they probably asked Type-Moon to see if they wanted to make a fighting game using their characters (since the game's setting wasn't that far from becoming a fighting game if they felt like it) two years later after the game was well-received by the community, which they agreed to. So the collaboration began. And it was a smash hit. Like I said earlier, commercial entities pay attention to the doujin community in order to help expose really good stuff that's produced here into the public if the group that made it hasn't entered the commercial market already. Ecole was one of them, and they decided that Melty Blood was worthy enough to see an arcade iteration, which then received a PS2 port, and then finally "came back home" on the PC just this past July. |
|
|
|
Post by zzz on Sept 25, 2007 13:55:37 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by dai jou bu on Sept 25, 2007 18:27:45 GMT -5
counter points, AND they're more recent than that NTSC-UK feature since he only talks about Tumiki Fighters and Perfect Cherry Blossom, the former existing at around 2004. The games mentioned on the websites I linked point out freeware titles but are classified as doujin since like Kurt said, "Doujin" is basically the Japanese equivalent of "homebrew", although I think an even closer word would be "independent". And I'd go with this too, because electronic distribution is completely different from storing them on a different physical medium since it's rather possible to give out your games for free instead of storing them on a medium that costs money which you need to get back by charging people money for it. Also, this change was also noted in feature too, and it's going to be left alone in future revisions: Traditionally, a third kanji is placed right after the second (shi), which means "document," and transforms the compound to mean a "fan-produced or self-published comic." However, since this website is about video games, we'd replace the last kanji with the English word "game" or "soft(ware)" instead to get "doujin soft" or "doujin game." It's basically the equivalent of homebrew or independent software, but it has a unique culture surrounding it.[/u][/quote] EDIT: Okay, that sounded a bit harsh there, which wasn't the kind of tone I was aiming for. I really don't have a problem with calling these games you can get online without having to pay money to the creator freeware, homebrew, or whatever new word that others are using to describe them. I am bothered about the word doujin to only mean "a creation in Japan that is self-published and/or mass-produced on a small scale that people have to pay money for," which is wrong since it is pretty much the Japanese equivalent to the English word "independent" or "self-published," (just like the French word ronde is the Japanese equivalent of rinbu which is the English equivalent of round dance  ) meaning that doujin can also be used to describe independent (as professionals can always come back to this scene if they ever felt like it) games that are created in Japan that are free of charge and widely distributed online.
|
|
|
|
Post by zzz on Sept 26, 2007 0:33:21 GMT -5
Yeah, but Doujinaroni is a French site, whereas OMEGA is actually a native Japanese speaker.
|
|
redcar
New Member
both red and a car
Posts: 5
|
Post by redcar on Sept 26, 2007 12:49:38 GMT -5
Hey, I've been a fan of this site for some time, although mostly I just tend to come here when I'm bored at work...today, though, I decided to join the forums after I saw this thread. I happen to be an avid fan of doujinsoft games you see, and a few weeks ago I endeavored to make a thread devoted to the same in the videogames section of my local anime club's small online forum, detailing various games and game series and why they are cool. I was impressed by the coincidence of this thread popping up here nearly concurrently, so I figured I'd jump in it and see if I could be of any help. I dunno if I can, but perhaps you'd be interested in things I have to say. I've only done Cave Story and the Touhou series (of which I am a great fan) on our small board thus far, and rather fanboyishly at that, but if you'd not planned to talk about it already I'd love to have something to do with this site and a little work would probably make it usable. I'm also intending to do Tsukihime on our board later and I'd be glad to give input towards an exposition of it here if such would be useful (if you decide it's worthy of the title 'doujin,' on which point I agree with dai jou bu). Please let me know if I can help!
|
|
Ethrin
Junior Member
Loves shooters, but sux at em.
Posts: 99
|
Post by Ethrin on Sept 26, 2007 14:38:25 GMT -5
If you don't want to change your PC over to Japanese, another solution is good ole AppLocale: www.microsoft.com/globaldev/tools/apploc.mspxIt not only saves you the reboot but sometimes other apps just don't play very nicely with the region set to Japanese. |
|
|
|
Post by Shinigami on Sept 26, 2007 15:50:51 GMT -5
I noticed that all backslashes on my computer ( \ ), such as in folder directories, have turned into yen symbols. Why is that? And is it going to affect anything?
|
|
|
|
Post by dai jou bu on Sept 26, 2007 15:57:17 GMT -5
Yeah, but Doujinaroni is a French site, whereas OMEGA is actually a native Japanese speaker. And what about the other site I linked to? Besides, you can attach doujin in front of the word homebrew or freeware and you'd pretty much get the same thing. I'm still not really buying it when other people say that these kinds of free games are still classified are doujin. Edit: I noticed that all backslashes on my computer ( \ ), such as in folder directories, have turned into yen symbols. Why is that? And is it going to affect anything? It shouldn't affect you much, if at all, as I've had no problems with my PC over the years in this configuration other than program installers (and possibly existing programs) with mutilingual support are going to display in Japanese. As for why this happens, I'm not exactly sure, but I guess that's the equivalent of their slashes over there. |
|
mooman1
New Member
it's like a custom title that everybody has!
Posts: 20
|
Post by mooman1 on Sept 27, 2007 11:02:43 GMT -5
Yay, now my Japanese programs don't show garbled text. Now all that's missing is for me to actually be literate in Japanese. There's a program somewhere called ATLAS that translates Japanese to English in real time. Problem is, it's about on the level of comprehensibility as Babelfish, plus, it's not free. There was something posted on not4chan about how to *ahem* acquire it and install it. For those not "in the know", flipping through not4chan is EXTREMELY nsfw, so do so with care. Also, simulationstyle.com has a copious quantity of dojinsoft, as well as music sim games like IIDX and Guitar Hero. It requires you register, but it's free. If I crossed several lines here, please delete this. |
|
|
|
Post by Discoalucard on Sept 27, 2007 14:04:34 GMT -5
I've only done Cave Story and the Touhou series (of which I am a great fan) on our small board thus far, and rather fanboyishly at that, but if you'd not planned to talk about it already I'd love to have something to do with this site and a little work would probably make it usable. I'm also intending to do Tsukihime on our board later and I'd be glad to give input towards an exposition of it here if such would be useful (if you decide it's worthy of the title 'doujin,' on which point I agree with dai jou bu). Please let me know if I can help! I'd definitely be willing to accept pretty much anything on any of these topics, or anything else doujin related you may want to touch on. You're welcome to post over here whatever you may have written for other boards as well. Thanks! |
|
redcar
New Member
both red and a car
Posts: 5
|
Post by redcar on Sept 27, 2007 15:24:28 GMT -5
I'd definitely be willing to accept pretty much anything on any of these topics, or anything else doujin related you may want to touch on. You're welcome to post over here whatever you may have written for other boards as well. Thanks! Awesome. dai jou bu msged me asking about it, and I replied to him that I know just about enough to do an article on Doukutsu Monogatari and more than enough to do one on Touhou games. I'd really rather send you a link to my writeups than dump them here (if you want to critique them and tell me what I should fix or something), but I will put them in this thread if you really want me to (assuming that's what you meant). I feel that what I have written thus far needs at least three different areas of improvement before it is worthy to put up on this site: I need to add in some negative aspects of the games, I need to adjust my writing to eliminate some very long and comma-laden sentences, and most of all I need to flesh everything out some more (as I abridged individual game entries for time and space considerations). I'll get to work on fixing it up right away. I will note, however, that due to work and transit times I have an average of about four hours of free time a day, so even going at full speed I may not be done immediately. I will definitely put it at the top of my priorities though. Please add me in for Project Shrine Maiden/Touhou games in the Reserved Article Thread, as they are what I will tackle first. |
|
mooman1
New Member
it's like a custom title that everybody has!
Posts: 20
|
Post by mooman1 on Sept 27, 2007 21:44:15 GMT -5
Ooh, I'd totally do an article on Cave Story if nobody else will.
|
|
redcar
New Member
both red and a car
Posts: 5
|
Post by redcar on Sept 27, 2007 22:34:43 GMT -5
Ooh, I'd totally do an article on Cave Story if nobody else will. Cave Story is one of my favorite videogames, and I do so dearly want to do an article on it (especially since I'm already half-started), I just don't want to keep someone else from writing about it while I'm working on Touhou. So I will write about it, but if you think you can tell people about it faster and/or better than I can then be my guest. |
|
mooman1
New Member
it's like a custom title that everybody has!
Posts: 20
|
Post by mooman1 on Sept 28, 2007 16:30:16 GMT -5
We'll see whose is better when we're finished, and maybe take stuff from each.
|
|
) meaning that doujin can also be used to describe independent (as professionals can always come back to this scene if they ever felt like it) games that are created in Japan that are free of charge and widely distributed online. 
