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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2011 17:21:07 GMT -5
Sorry to go against the grain here, but I thought the basis of this weekly kusoge premise was more subjective than anything? I don't think Druaga's history should be the focus of talking about its MANY faults, and... well, frankly, I just don't think the original Druaga is a very good game. I also feel the same way about Hydlide; regardless of how groundbreaking it was back then, it's still full of elements to riff upon. So goes the old adage, "you can't polish a turd."
I think the weekly kusoge would work best if we treat it more like the online equivalent of Rifftrax, in which ANY movie, bad or good, is fair game. Not necessarily in the sense that we want to outright lampoon the games, but just talking about them while admitting their many flaws from either a modern or classic perspective.
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Post by Discoalucard on Jan 13, 2011 17:35:13 GMT -5
The tone is meant to be gently mocking, though, which really only applies to certain subset of games. Open up the topic to any game and then you end up with Zero Punctuation.
What I've been trying to do with the site is understand the context of a game when it was released and its impact on the culture. Druaga is probably a Bad Game - I can't stand it, personally - but just sitting and writing a few paragraphs about how obtuse it is feels like it's disrespecting its legacy, where the site would be better served in explaining it.
To use another example with a different game, it would be like doing a kusoge article on the original King's Quest. Yeah, it's pretty awful in a lot of ways, but it has so much history behind it.
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Post by Snarboo on Jan 13, 2011 17:39:32 GMT -5
A game's quality isn't based solely on its history or ideas. No amount of overambitious design elements and prestige can save a bad game. Trespasser on PC is a beautiful example of this: it was a game way ahead of its time, with one of the first physics systems seen in gaming. I've played the game to completion and I even love it in an ugly dog sort of way, but no amount of admonishment will change the fact that it's a terrible, broken and ugly game.
It's easy to look back at a game with rose tinted glasses or overlook a game's flaws in a modern setting, one where guides are abundant and emulation is rampant. We don't have to deal with the issues gamers of the past did, and in order to understand a game's reception, you have to examine how it was received at the time. In that sense, Druaga easily qualifies as a kusoge, just as Trespasser does. Both were frustrating messes that have become something of a curio in the modern age.
Honestly, I'm not sure an article like this is a good idea when no one can agree on what exactly a kusoge is. Is it just bad games, or do well regarded but poorly designed games qualify too? Should we take into account modern opinions and interpretations of bad games, or look solely at how it was received at the time?
I was hoping this article would be more of a casual examination of what each of us consider "guilty pleasures" and how games leave an impact on us regardless of quality. I'm not necessarily concerned with whether a game is objectively a kusoge or not, but rather why the writer considers it as one. It's okay for their to be differences in opinion, so long as the writer argues their point in a respectful manner.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2011 18:38:01 GMT -5
I'm guessing that I misunderstood the tone or intent of this feature. It's not really clear that the YWK feature was a one-shot deal for games that didn't rate full articles, and that's where I got confused.
Also to clarify, I never said anything about mocking Druaga or its legacy, and didn't intend my proposed entry as such. I am in the minority and legitimately enjoy it, but I can also stand back and say that it suffers from some pretty serious flaws that would have been as evident back then as they are today.
From a black and white perspective, though, Druaga meets two of the bullet points listed at the beginning of the Ikki article (almost comical difficulty and obtuseness), and arguably a third (tediousness). If anything, I thought this would be a good way to offer both sides of those points, but also poke fun at some of those shortcomings (and discuss some of the practices it inspired). At the same time I agree that the series deserves a more in-depth look.
I will say that it's somewhat subjective what a kusoge is, and I think that could be an issue with Your Weekly Kusoge if it isn't nailed down. Where is the line drawn, and when does a game have too much history to apply?
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Post by Jave on Jan 13, 2011 18:39:14 GMT -5
For me, if it's going to be one or the other (not saying it has to be) then I would rather see a full retrospective article on Druaga than a few hundred words on why it's bad. That's not to say that I don't think it's a Kusoge, I would definitely say that it is, just that I think it's more interesting than the format of this article might suggest.
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Post by Discoalucard on Jan 13, 2011 19:02:18 GMT -5
Honestly if it weren't for the history associated with it, Druaga would be a perfect fit. Think of this more of an exception rather than a rule.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2011 10:52:17 GMT -5
Honestly if it weren't for the history associated with it, Druaga would be a perfect fit. Think of this more of an exception rather than a rule. Yeah, sorry about that...I didn't mean to come off as belligerent. To get back on topic, I'd love to read an article on Sherlock Holmes for Famicom. The idea of Sherlock Holmes jump-kicking information out of people is kind of amusing.
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Post by Discoalucard on Jan 14, 2011 11:03:56 GMT -5
To get back on topic, I'd love to read an article on Sherlock Holmes for Famicom. The idea of Sherlock Holmes jump-kicking information out of people is kind of amusing. Why did I not know such a game existed! It's not a Famicom Detective Club type game, is it?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2011 11:47:39 GMT -5
To get back on topic, I'd love to read an article on Sherlock Holmes for Famicom. The idea of Sherlock Holmes jump-kicking information out of people is kind of amusing. Why did I not know such a game existed! It's not a Famicom Detective Club type game, is it? I got it in a bulk buy years ago - it's kind of like the first Saint Seiya game minus the RPG battles. That and it reminds me of an old PC game called Agent USA. Apparently there's one with some Detective Club adventure scenes that came out later. In this one you talk to people by kicking information and money out of them.
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Post by Discoalucard on Jan 14, 2011 19:56:58 GMT -5
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Post by Discoalucard on Jan 20, 2011 18:09:31 GMT -5
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Post by cj iwakura on Jan 20, 2011 18:41:56 GMT -5
Well deserved. I unaffectionately dub those losers Idea Hacktory.
Chaos Wars? Yeah, them too.
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Post by Warchief Onyx on Jan 21, 2011 2:01:32 GMT -5
Has Idea Factory ever made a good game? Every time I hear about a game made by them the reaction is usually that it's garbage. Makes you wonder how they stay in business if they have this bad reputation even in Japan.
I like "Idea Fucktory," personally. It's like a place where good ideas go to get fucked in the ass.
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Post by acidonia on Jan 21, 2011 14:47:38 GMT -5
I do not know about that but stay Away from their PS2 action game Neverland Senki Zero aka Realm of the Dead in Europe. Things wrong with game. : Looks like a early /late Ps1 title but was made in 2004 : Random spawing power ups that most become useless by the end of the game : Plays very badly and jerky : you have to this weird lifing like move to get rid of certain objects when others hiting anything works : Enemys become way to strong fast thakfully there AI is dumb as rocks I once tricked a boss to contantly run into a wall when I was a few just behind it. : it is next to impossible without the auto healing power later on that takes like over 8mins to fully heal you ; When you kill a boss it shows a cut scene of it falling over yet the said cut scene is just a blury video using in game models. It also only shows the boss falling over in a spot light rest of the screen is black. : The still artwork looks nothing like any of the enemys you face in the game or anyone in the game. : The European cover makes no sence to the game Good Points : The game has alot of levels shame they all suck for the above reasons. : The Intro is awesomely cheesy and has very little to do with the PLot also Engrishy song www.youtube.com/watch?v=mciUa0oooFoI bought another Idea Factory game at the same time as this called Spectral Vs Generation though that is a ok Fighter sure it aint no street Fighter but it not a the Worst 2d sprite fighting game out there at least. Though IGS developed that not Ideal Factory. Weirdest thing about Spectral Vs Generation is that the European Publisher Midas made a PSP port of it no PSP version existed in japan it also got on PSN store in America as well this way.
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Post by cj iwakura on Jan 22, 2011 0:24:09 GMT -5
Has Idea Factory ever made a good game? Every time I hear about a game made by them the reaction is usually that it's garbage. Makes you wonder how they stay in business if they have this bad reputation even in Japan. I like "Idea Fucktory," personally. It's like a place where good ideas go to get fucked in the ass. NIS America seem to know there's a desperate JRPG following out there that'll buy dang near anything, and they eat up their crappy games. I wouldn't mind so much if there weren't genuinely GOOD RPGs we could be getting instead. Effort wasted on bad games makes me sad.
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