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Post by excelsior on Aug 15, 2022 13:48:40 GMT -5
The awful d-pad is inexcusable, but my specific issue is that they are fairly unreliable in the long term. My original controller lasted around three years of moderate use before some of the buttons started failing. I could never find a new first party controller, and every used one was fairly busted up. I think bought and returned four used controllers that also had non-functional buttons before finding a fifth where at least only the rumble was busted. Maybe I'm just lucky but 3 or my 4 original PS2 controllers are fully functioning still. The d-pad is dreadful, I agree with that (also the analogue sticks are too loose,) but the original XBox's 'Duke' controller has a d-pad that struggles to really even be called that. It's almost unusable as it just slips around as a whole. Also every face button on there is clicky, slow and poorly spaced. There's an inconsistency to the size making some buttons hard to find and some are even out of reach, due in part to the monstrously oversized and uncomfortable shape of the controller. And of course the back bumpers were also slow to use and pretty useless for most games. Pretty much a controller with no redeeming features. For the PS2's benefit every face and shoulder button is easy to reach and use, properly responsive and the shape was ergonomic enough for the time. If we're basing it on failure rates then I'd call the Switch Joy Con's the worst controller - at least as far as 'main' console controllers go. I've had more failure's for those than any other console and the thing is only 5.5 years old. Also replacements are way too expensive.
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Post by 🧀Son of Suzy Creamcheese🧀 on Aug 15, 2022 14:39:54 GMT -5
This is bait, right? The PS2 controller wasn't even the worst controller of it's generation. I'm sure it's not actually the worst one of all time, but it's definitely the worst 1st party controller (along with the PS1/PS3 obviously) I've ever used and the worst controller I own (not counting broken controllers). I'm sure the 5200 controller or something is worse. It's by far the worst of its gen though. Maybe the duke is worse, don't own one, but I honestly can't imagine it is. I own an Xbox so I guess I could find out one day (they're not that expensive). But the smaller Xbox controller at least is miles above the PS1/2/3, not to mention the GCN. And at least MS had the good sense to replace the duke, unlike Sony which kept the same design for 3 consoles in a row.
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Post by spanky on Aug 15, 2022 14:43:52 GMT -5
See, I had the worst luck with GCN controllers, with several buttons going bad. Plus I honestly have always hated the design.
I do agree that the Joycons kinda stink. Mine has horrible drift and is basically unusable. I'm not overly impressed with the Switch Pro controller either. The D-pad feels very mushy to me and isn't satisfying to play retro games with, which is too bad since that's one of the draws to the system for me.
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Post by dsparil on Aug 15, 2022 14:44:44 GMT -5
The Xbox controller is awful as an actual controller even the S. The button placement is so haphazard. It's not like it was even Microsoft's first gamepad so the whole thing is so perplexing. There's some internal photo where a Sidewinder Dual Strike was used as the controller in a prototype, and that would have actually been interesting. Those things were so weird, but also legitimately innovative. The Xbox killed the Sidewinder line, but it would have liked a revised version of that controller. JoyCons are the worst from a failure perspective, no question about that. Nintendo could have saved themselves a whole lot of trouble by setting up a supplier with a more robust part. The problem with them is that the potentiometer, the component that measures the stick motion, uses graphite so they wear easily and the debris build up causes problems too. Nintendo cheaped out on the motion control hardware too. Then there's the Labo related IR hardware that drives up the cost even though Labo flopped. I like the Pro controller overall, but the d-pad could be better. I got used to it eventually but it is too mushy until it's broken in.
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Post by 🧀Son of Suzy Creamcheese🧀 on Aug 15, 2022 15:14:22 GMT -5
I've also had to replace both the L and R Joycons twice, but my current pair has held up perfectly after a lot of extensive use. The d-pad on the pro controller has been a very mixed bag for me. For some purposes it works perfectly (Picross), for Mario it works alright but not ideal, for Mega Man 11 I had to switch to cradled Joycons of all things to get anywhere. For Nintendo standards it's definitely a bad d-pad. It's still their best controller since the GCN though. See, I had the worst luck with GCN controllers, with several buttons going bad. We had only one official Nintendo GCN controller back when I was a kid, and that I still use it 18 years later. The rubber on the left stick has been gone for years, but other than that it still feels perfect despite seeing probably at least 10.000 hours of use. I've had some less luck with buying second-hand controllers, but the SSB4/SSBU GCN controllers have so far been very durable and are pretty affordable, so I'd recommend one of those if anyone ever needs a GCN controller (they also have longer wires IIRC). Okay, now this is bait.
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Post by retr0gamer on Aug 15, 2022 15:21:21 GMT -5
The original playstation controller and the dualshock variants were awful when they came out and continued to be awful. Kids who grew up only on playstation sing its praises but I think that its a form of stockholm syndrome. Even I don't mind it anymore due to the fact that for so long the PS1 and 2 were the only real contenders in the console war but it was always heaven going back to a saturn, N64 or Gamecube controller. The d-pad is just rotten. I was so glad it got a long overdue change with the PS4 and since then PS controllers have been so much better.
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Post by retr0gamer on Aug 15, 2022 15:25:21 GMT -5
The Xbox controller is awful as an actual controller even the S. The button placement is so haphazard. It's not like it was even Microsoft's first gamepad so the whole thing is so perplexing. There's some internal photo where a Sidewinder Dual Strike was used as the controller in a prototype, and that would have actually been interesting. Those things were so weird, but also legitimately innovative. The Xbox killed the Sidewinder line, but it would have liked a revised version of that controller. JoyCons are the worst from a failure perspective, no question about that. Nintendo could have saved themselves a whole lot of trouble by setting up a supplier with a more robust part. The problem with them is that the potentiometer, the component that measures the stick motion, uses graphite so they wear easily and the debris build up causes problems too. Nintendo cheaped out on the motion control hardware too. Then there's the Labo related IR hardware that drives up the cost even though Labo flopped. I like the Pro controller overall, but the d-pad could be better. I got used to it eventually but it is too mushy until it's broken in. The very first sidewinder pad is legit one of the greatest gamepads ever made. The d-pad is fantastic and the 6 face buttons were great when every other controller was trying to ape playstation with 4 face buttons. Best of all was the daisy chaining. I never saw a PC with more than one controller port but you could daisy chain sidewinder controllers together and play up to 4 player. It got a lot of use for emulators as it was a fantastic controller for capcom fighters and 4 player brawlers. MS even returned to the design with a usb version of it after making worse controllers. Would love to get my hands on one.
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Post by excelsior on Aug 15, 2022 15:31:48 GMT -5
It's not like the Gamecube had a good d-pad either. The only decent d-pad for the gen was on Dreamcast.
For Microsoft I do think they've gotten a lot better. The Elite controller is really something, though of course it's sold at a premium. Generally their pads are pretty ergonomic nowadays.
I don't really care for the Joy Cons really. It's clear they had to make a lot of compromises for the compatibility they were going for. They are undeniably impressive for versatility but the components are all very cheap and generally it's an uncomfortable controller. For Nintendo I actually thought the Wii U had very nice controllers. The Gamecube is my favourite but it really is only designed around Nintendo's own games.
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Post by personman on Aug 15, 2022 17:33:10 GMT -5
Personally never had any issues with the DualShock myself but compared to the other consoles they did feel very flimsy. I think the original for my PS2 actually lasted me till about 10 years or so when the circle button started to go kaput. I may have just been lucky.
Off the top of my head I think my least favorite controller would be the Dreamcast one. There was just something about its buttons I didn't like, felt chinsy.
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Post by JDarkside on Aug 15, 2022 17:38:22 GMT -5
I was fine with the Gamecube one when I had a gamecube and seeing one now drives me crazy due to realizing how hellish it is for certain games I play now I did not then. Like how the fuck did anyone map a FPS on that thing. Bonkers. N64 is worse obviously, only Nintendo really understood how to use that.
Favorite is the Xbox One controller, good weight, triggers were a great decision to allow a larger set of buttons for developers to work with that honestly feel better than the 1 2 set up on the dual shock (which I like, even if it is pretty light). Only issue is that it isn't ideal when I'm trying to get screenshots as I need a pinky awkwardly on the mapped key on my keyboard, which messes with the weight. That's just a me issue, tough, casual play not getting screens is perfectly enjoyable.
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Post by lurker on Aug 15, 2022 21:43:22 GMT -5
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Post by lurker on Aug 16, 2022 0:51:50 GMT -5
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Post by excelsior on Aug 17, 2022 1:24:07 GMT -5
I decided to start playing Tales of Symphonia which will be my second entry into the Tales of series. I was looking for something much more straightforward and that I can take at a slow pace following going so all in with Xenoblade 3. So far it's not capturing me particularly, but its charming enough to stick with for now. I know the game has a good reputation but I don't know how much of that is due to being a rare RPG on Gamecube.
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Post by retr0gamer on Aug 17, 2022 2:59:15 GMT -5
I enjoyed it but it's pretty standard JRPG fare. The story is a mix of FFX and the usual tales trope of two worlds, nothing mind blowing. It probably went on a little too long. Also kind of ruined subsequent Tales games because it felt like I'd played them already since they were so similar to Symphonia. This was a while ago so my opinion might change if I placed it today.
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Post by JDarkside on Aug 17, 2022 16:42:36 GMT -5
Symphonia still stands up due to its story ultimately being really good. It's certainly not inventive, but every idea and story beat is well acted upon and has some good emotional impact.
I cannot say this about Legendia, which is an unfinished mess with some really bad ideas in the second half that I find gross.This sucks because it has a unique battle system for the series due to being a side project for Tekken devs, having a limited area of movement on a 2D plane to make you more aggressive and try creating combos.
Abyss is my favorite entirely for how every single twist genuinely turns the entire story on its head, and does a great job at deconstructing a cast of emotionally stunted people and their faults while making direct comparisons to the antagonists, who are actually somewhat sympathetic when you start to understand their motivations.
Still need to put time in Berseria but it had a great first impression in that the entire cast is extremely messed up in often purposefully funny ways, the villains you just anna dunk on for being holier than thou church dorks, and the lead character is not just a girl but hinted to be bisexual, which is pretty rad. Also, the awful clown elf everyone hates but lets stick around anyways.
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