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Post by GamerL on Oct 23, 2017 17:40:22 GMT -5
Seems kinda silly to let something that minor break your immersion.
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Post by ommadawnyawn2 on Oct 23, 2017 19:30:03 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure none of this is voluntary.
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Haruka
Junior Member
Posts: 69
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Post by Haruka on Oct 24, 2017 14:26:39 GMT -5
When an environment that's supposed to be a real place where people work and live is structured in a very "game level" way that makes no sense in context of the story. Bioshock Infinite is a perfect example of this, there's so many floating islands that are oddly linear or only have a few buildings or are just generally designed in a way that make no sense if you remember this is supposed to be a real city, the first Bioshock was somewhat like that too, though not as bad. But for an example of a game that does this perfectly there's Prey 2017, the Talos 1 stations feels like a real place and everything in it is designed in a way that makes functional sense. This reminds of a commonly seen obstacle in platform games: the floating platform that moves back and forth in a set pattern. For example, older Castlevania games tend to have a lot of these but in the context of the game's world it doesn't really make sense that they exist. They're supposed to be an obstacle for the heroes but at the same time they also act as a convenient way to get across the castle's various instant-death pits. In other words, they're an example of both "malevolent" and "benevolent" level design. Dragon Quest is one of the old-school RPG series to have merchants in all the dungeons, but it came off as deliberate and whimsical. Personally I don't have the capacity for immersion I had as a kid, so I can put up with a lot of nonsense in videogames because it doesn't matter anyway. Unlike movies, where a single scene I don't find believable within the movie's context can take me right out of it. I will say it's worse when a takes itself intensely seriously and its storyline is sub-comic book / Da Vinci Code pap (Assassin's Creed, Watch Dogs). Actually, one that bothers me a lot in modern games are the transparent attempts at morally justifying wholesale murder. Like, most videogame protagonists are raging psychopaths if you think about it, so you're probably better off not dwelling on that aspect too much, unless you're really going to be thorough with it. I think the protagonist of a game slaughtering mooks left and right without remorse is easiest to justify in games with take place in a fantasy world because you could argue the "world view" of that game's universe is one of black and white morality. On the other hand, if a game takes place in the "real world" then it can be very jarring (a notorious example being the Uncharted games). I do think it's interesting when games draw attention to the fact what you're doing is morally reprehensible. For example, a horror-RPG I recently played, The Screamer, literally opens with the words: " The only way to survive is to dehumanize yourself and face to bloodshed". |
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Post by Snake on Oct 24, 2017 15:59:11 GMT -5
When Shinobi falls into the ocean. And dies. Muthafucka can take out Batman morphing Spiderman, an Incredible Hulk Terminator hybrid, Godzilla, and the head honcho of Neo Zeed. But he can't fuckin' swim worth a damn. I guess that's one kind of super shinobi.
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Post by lurker on Oct 24, 2017 16:13:01 GMT -5
Not sure if this counts since it's more with the instruction manual, but the main character in Eternal Ring is referred to as being "allergic to water".
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Post by Exhuminator on Oct 24, 2017 17:46:46 GMT -5
Not sure if this counts since it's more with the instruction manual, but the main character in Eternal Ring is referred to as being "allergic to water". When I beat Eternal Ring I wondered what the deal with the Water Temple was. I didn't read the manual, so there you go. How Cain Morgan, a human, therefore his body is mostly made of water, can be allergic to water, boggles the mind. |
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Post by GamerL on Oct 24, 2017 17:53:51 GMT -5
When an environment that's supposed to be a real place where people work and live is structured in a very "game level" way that makes no sense in context of the story. Bioshock Infinite is a perfect example of this, there's so many floating islands that are oddly linear or only have a few buildings or are just generally designed in a way that make no sense if you remember this is supposed to be a real city, the first Bioshock was somewhat like that too, though not as bad. But for an example of a game that does this perfectly there's Prey 2017, the Talos 1 stations feels like a real place and everything in it is designed in a way that makes functional sense. This reminds of a commonly seen obstacle in platform games: the floating platform that moves back and forth in a set pattern. For example, older Castlevania games tend to have a lot of these but in the context of the game's world it doesn't really make sense that they exist. They're supposed to be an obstacle for the heroes but at the same time they also act as a convenient way to get across the castle's various instant-death pits. In other words, they're an example of both "malevolent" and "benevolent" level design. I think the protagonist of a game slaughtering mooks left and right without remorse is easiest to justify in games with take place in a fantasy world because you could argue the "world view" of that game's universe is one of black and white morality. On the other hand, if a game takes place in the "real world" then it can be very jarring (a notorious example being the Uncharted games). I do think it's interesting when games draw attention to the fact what you're doing is morally reprehensible. For example, a horror-RPG I recently played, The Screamer, literally opens with the words: " The only way to survive is to dehumanize yourself and face to bloodshed". Castlevania at least makes more sense than many 8 bit/16 bit titles in that you can say all these platforms and traps are to prevent our heroes from reaching Dracula, even if like you said they're contradically actually helpful to getting there, but there was a time when levels were not at all designed as if they were real places, even a first person game like Doom didn't care about that. I wanna say the first game to have it's environment designed as if it was a real place outside of say point and click adventure games is the original System Shock, though even then it's still pretty "gamey" but feels more real if you're comparing it to something like Doom. |
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Post by lurker on Oct 24, 2017 20:01:58 GMT -5
Not sure if this counts since it's more with the instruction manual, but the main character in Eternal Ring is referred to as being "allergic to water". When I beat Eternal Ring I wondered what the deal with the Water Temple was. I didn't read the manual, so there you go. How Cain Morgan, a human, therefore his body is mostly made of water, can be allergic to water, boggles the mind. The funny thing is that they could have easily gone with "he can't swim" and it would have made more sense and achieved the same ingame result. |
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Post by ResidentTsundere on Oct 25, 2017 2:13:12 GMT -5
Graphical clipping. Some games are good at hiding or avoiding it during cutscenes, others do not. XD
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Post by elektrolurch on Oct 25, 2017 8:38:08 GMT -5
. As a result, I ended up inventing a reason for why this was possible (the main character owns a magical bag which acts like a pocket dimension which can be used for storing large amounts of items). After that my immersion was restored. ..there do exist magic bags in many wrpgs, neverwinter nights for example, that add inventory space..  so there are games that see this problem and kinda fix it.. i.. really thought hard and I can say, I never really experienced immersion breaks or something like suspension of disbelief in gaming, probably mainly because, well, I've been raised with games in an era were games were always abstract,pixely, non realtic, so I don't really have the expectation that they behave realistically and that everything makes sense from a "rational standpoint" of our shared "objective reality". Honestly, I like it best when games have their own distinct logic and rules the player needs to explore that make no sense whatsoever at first glance. A lot of now classic adventure games really excell at this, think of Myst or the Neverhood... Undertale also does this pretty well in my mind... |
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Post by Ike on Oct 25, 2017 15:10:08 GMT -5
I never did get the importance of cockpit view in racing games. You literally stare through 2 bloody screens--one is your monitor, and the next is car's windshield in-game. It just obstructs a view and it supposed to replicate the real thing. Really? If you ever get the chance to play with a real deal setup and go into cab mode it's a pretty cool experience. Like if you have the whole steering wheel/pedal/gear shift thing. Playing with a manual transmission in Cruisin' USA's arcade cabinet is one of my favorite childhood memories. |
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Post by Bumpyroad on Oct 26, 2017 0:41:47 GMT -5
I never did get the importance of cockpit view in racing games. You literally stare through 2 bloody screens--one is your monitor, and the next is car's windshield in-game. It just obstructs a view and it supposed to replicate the real thing. Really? If you ever get the chance to play with a real deal setup and go into cab mode it's a pretty cool experience. Like if you have the whole steering wheel/pedal/gear shift thing. Playing with a manual transmission in Cruisin' USA's arcade cabinet is one of my favorite childhood memories. You know, i've been thinking about VR thing recently. That'd be interesting to try, it would give me a whole different visual perspective i suppose. Dirt Rally in VR mode for instance. |
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Post by zerker on Oct 26, 2017 15:53:07 GMT -5
I have a wheel setup at home, and I still somewhat agree that the cockpit view isn't great; my personal preference is the hood cam. Basically, whatever camera looks closest to being 'the same as the windshield'. Though cockpit views are nice for offering the proper dials in the correct locations.
Having recently played through 999 and Virtue's Last Reward, my suspension of disbelief was broken any time morphogenetic fields were involved. Or pseudoscience in general when it conflicts with what we already know about the world.
...or when the director lazily introduced some generic Sci-fi trope, especially if it's traditionally associated with a particular author (3 laws of robotics, anyone?).
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Post by eatersthemanfool on Oct 26, 2017 21:48:26 GMT -5
Oh yea, lazy pseudoscience is a big thing for me. Like, your basic scifi tropes don't bother me, even stuff like morphogenic fields doesn't bother me that much, but I really hate it when you get stuff like....
I can't think of a specific gaming example, but the worst example of this is something that I read in a horror short story once. It was totally serious, btw. There was a plot device where a character grew giant bugs by dumping itching powder into a vat of growth hormone.
Because the growth hormone made the bugs that make the itching powder itch grow to giant size.
I have run across shit that stupid in games. Just can't think of anything offhand.
Shit like that is also why I have a hard time with Dr. Who.
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Post by toei on Oct 26, 2017 22:05:01 GMT -5
Oh yea, lazy pseudoscience is a big thing for me. Like, your basic scifi tropes don't bother me, even stuff like morphogenic fields doesn't bother me that much, but I really hate it when you get stuff like.... I can't think of a specific gaming example, but the worst example of this is something that I read in a horror short story once. It was totally serious, btw. There was a plot device where a character grew giant bugs by dumping itching powder into a vat of growth hormone. Because the growth hormone made the bugs that make the itching powder itch grow to giant size. I have run across shit that stupid in games. Just can't think of anything offhand. Shit like that is also why I have a hard time with Dr. Who. Assassin's Creed |
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so there are games that see this problem and kinda fix it..
