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Post by justjustin on Feb 16, 2011 19:10:43 GMT -5
Running should be default. The normal walking speed is painfully slow. I like having control over my speed. Sometimes it's better to walk to carefully dodge things, but 95% of the time I'm double-tapping to dash everywhere. I really like how the characters move, though. When you let go after dashing your character still glides, and you can turn around and shoot/slice while still maintaining that momentum. Very helpful in a lot of cases. You can also do a mini slide by holding down after a dash, you'll glide for a sec which is helpful for closing in on enemies while they fire. The only thing that bothers me about the controls is that you cannot turn around while crouching. Pretty bad when you're ducking under a projectile and there's a guy coming up behind you. You can either stand up and die from the bullet or stay crouched and get trampled on from behind... optimally, you'd never get yourself in that situation, but it's still annoying. The more I play it, the more I'm convinced this is an authentic arcade title. To get higher scores at the end of a stage you can't use a continue, so there's the 1cc incentive right there. Also, extra lives are distributed at very key locations-- one in the first stage in case you screw up or another for stage 2 and a couple of obvious ones in stage 3 just about the time you might be getting low when you're first playing. There are also medals you can collect, but I'm not sure how they factor in yet. Even the chaining bar requires good command of the level. Stuff like this really emphasizes perfect playing. I'm surprised how well-balanced the game is, it must have been played to death before it was released. |
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Post by vetus on Feb 16, 2011 22:07:39 GMT -5
At last, it's finally here! Thanks heaven for the PS2 joypad converter I just bought few days ago, so @#$%^&* you X-Box D-pad!
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Post by kitten on Feb 16, 2011 23:20:13 GMT -5
I wasn't immediately impressed, but I'm starting to like it a lot. It's very impressive on a lot of levels, and I think the thing that I like the most about it is that it barely copies older Contra games in any way and really sets out to make a name for itself. While it plays a fair bit different from any other Contra, it's still a really solid (if not excellent, I'll have to play it more, I've only beaten Rising mode with one character and barely touched arcade mode) run n gun game. I really didn't mind spending extra on the bonus characters, as the quality of the production values and obvious care that went into this game easily make it worth a premium price above other arcade titles.
I assume they wanted to launch the game at $20 or so with all the characters, and the DLC was their way of being able to get Microsoft to agree with it and appeal to a wider audience (while still getting that extra bit out of the big fan). The extra characters actually do add quite a bit to the game, too, and are well animated with a variety of upgrades for the "Rising" mode, so they're not just tacked on, by any means.
My biggest problem with the game is that the stages are like a BILLION YEARS LONG. Completing the game, start to finish, has got to take something like 2 or more hours (there are 8 stages), which is fucking absurd for a game like this. While each stage is genuinely packed to the brim with content, I feel like they really could have cut some of it out for better pacing. The boss battles also have health out the wazoo and can take a fucking ridiculous amount of time to kill (the final boss has silly health).
I mean, the game isn't poorly designed or anything, but there are a few platforming segments in most stages that could be cut in length and the bosses could have had their health reduced - the amount of pounding some of them can take nearly makes the game boring, especially if you're reduced to the default weapon (p.s. you will be the first few times on most of them, even if you're a Contra veteran).
The difficulty level is probably the highest Contra has ever seen and there's as much memorization and trial and error as there was in Shattered Soldier, combined with a lot of hectic challenge. I've been dying a pretty big amount (reminds me of when I was a kid), and it's mostly my own fault (and partially because Rising Mode makes you grind for some abilities you get off the bat in arcade mode). There are a few parts I've found a bit cheap, but for the most part, it's really well-designed.
My overall opinion is hard to say, but I want to repeat myself - it's really solid, and possibly excellent. At the very least, it's been worth my $20, and I think my opinion of it is only going to go up as I play it more. I'm considering Rising mode to be an elaborate "practice mode" for now, and it's going to likely keep me coming back for a long time before I max out my characters and get a lot of these achievements.
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Post by X-pert74 on Feb 17, 2011 5:04:14 GMT -5
I had no idea this even had a release date! It's nice to see it's finally out. I'm not sure whether to get the 360 or PS3 version though. I'd prefer the PS3 d-pad, but if I were to play this game online (which I might actually do, since it's Contra), I imagine it would be easier for me to do so on the 360, since I've already got a 360 headset.
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Post by retr0gamer on Feb 17, 2011 6:09:37 GMT -5
I really like the demo and will be picking it but, my one problem is that I hate the 360 controller for it, especially using the shoulder buttons particularly for dash. I've always hated the dual shock but I'd kill to play this on PS3.
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Post by justjustin on Feb 17, 2011 7:58:38 GMT -5
My biggest problem with the game is that the stages are like a BILLION YEARS LONG. Completing the game, start to finish, has got to take something like 2 or more hours (there are 8 stages), which is fucking absurd for a game like this. Yeah, the length is unreal. It would definitely be a better game if each stage was trimmed down to the most fun parts. I have the same problem with Gradius V and Sin and Punishment 2. They're "arcade" titles, yet sitting down and completing them on a credit is kind of tiring. It's good to think of Rising mode as an elaborate practice mode, I feel the same. All my impressions have come from the arcade mode, which is better balanced. Not 100 percent sure, but I think the enemies take fewer hits to kill in arcade mode. It does seem tweaked in some way. |
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Post by Discoalucard on Feb 17, 2011 10:48:55 GMT -5
Yeah, the length is unreal. It would definitely be a better game if each stage was trimmed down to the most fun parts. I have the same problem with Gradius V and Sin and Punishment 2. They're "arcade" titles, yet sitting down and completing them on a credit is kind of tiring. They aren't really arcade titles though - while there's an achievement for it, this (and S&P2) really weren't created for 1cc or game long score runs. I think that negates the issue about the long levels, if you're only meant to play them one or two at a time. The Rising Mode is pretty much the ideal when it comes to putting these types of games in a modern context. There are some niggling design issues here and there as the thread has mentioned, but I think this easily makes it the best Contra title since Shattered Soldier. |
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Post by retr0gamer on Feb 17, 2011 14:18:49 GMT -5
I see it's already getting unfairly criticised by hack games journalists for being too tough. It's basically marking a game down because you aren't qualified to review it. By that I don't mean not a good enough player but someone who just doesn't know games.
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Post by Discoalucard on Feb 17, 2011 14:43:28 GMT -5
I see it's already getting unfairly criticised by hack games journalists for being too tough. It's basically marking a game down because you aren't qualified to review it. By that I don't mean not a good enough player but someone who just doesn't know games. I don't understand those criticisms at all. If it were only the Arcade mode, and the game requires that you go through all 8 stages with only 3 credits...yeah, I can see them lambasting them for that. But Rising Mode is REALLY generous. You can start at any stage you've reached, there are at least two checkpoints and you've given three credits. You can upgrade weapons AND health substantially, and the scoring system incentivizes grinding smarter over grinding harder, so you can do it pretty quickly if you've found the best places to rack up high combos (which are as early as the second level!) Even in the standards of Contra, so far it's definitely not as difficult as Shattered Soldier, 4 or the original Hard Corps, especially since there are numerous defensive manuevers (air dashing, double jumps, bullet reflecting, all of kinds of stuff I haven't unlocked/figured out.) There are certain games where I can understand the reviewer writing off as "too difficult", but this isn't one of them. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2011 14:56:23 GMT -5
I like how they give you a reason to use each of the weapons, too. I don't like the style of the heat gun (should have just been a regular flamethrower, in my opinion), but it's nice that it can cancel out enemy fire. Haven't quite figured out the right way to use the crush gun, but that's pretty much been the case with every Contra I've ever played.
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Post by Ryu the Grappler on Feb 17, 2011 17:11:42 GMT -5
I see it's already getting unfairly criticised by hack games journalists for being too tough. They're probably the same kind of idiots who perpetuate the myth that the NES version is unbeatable without the Konami Code. What's wrong with a game being "too hard" anyway? Isn't the purpose of a video game to offer a challenge? I can understand if it's because of some design issue, but most of the time people are just complaining just because they can't get pass through a certain stage or boss. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2011 17:16:27 GMT -5
What's wrong with a game being "too hard" anyway? Because some people would like to be able to enjoy the experience of a certain game without being stuck on it for too long. There's a difference between "challenging" and "frustrating". Once something crosses that line, it's no longer fun. No game should ever have a single moment that isn't "fun". |
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Post by justjustin on Feb 17, 2011 18:16:25 GMT -5
They aren't really arcade titles though - while there's an achievement for it, this (and S&P2) really weren't created for 1cc or game long score runs. I think that negates the issue about the long levels, if you're only meant to play them one or two at a time. The length makes it seem like less of an arcade game, but when I consider other factors I feel the overall design sides closer to an arcade game. Like in Uprising's case, why distribute lives in certain areas, or give you a more powerful version of a weapon when collected twice, or give you an extra score bonus at the end of a level without continuing? Why design it that way if the player is only expected to work through a few levels at a time? The few examples I mentioned are long-term rewards; incentives for playing well without dying. If you die a lot you'll be stuck with the crappy starting weapon, everything goes down slower so the game is tougher, it's harder to keep the score chain bar filled, more difficult to stock lives for later (tougher) levels, and impossible to get a good score. Optimally, you would not die at all, making the game easier in the long run, thus achieving a 1cc. To me it really feels balanced for playing on one credit. I understand not everyone plays for a 1cc, and that's totally fine, but for those who do it's very nice to see the game designed around this aspect even if-- as in Uprising and Sin and Punishment 2's case-- the game is a little too long, and has "console" elements like choosing any level or buying power-ups. It was a very smart choice to keep those modes separate from each other. All that to say, I do feel the length is a problem because it conflicts with the arcade-like design. I am very surprised despite the length of the levels they hold up so well, so kudos to Arc System Works, but I think shorter would have been a better option to better balance the overall design. I think a shorter length for the levels would have promoted more repeated play. Cut the fat out of those stages and I'll bet it would last longer, not because of actual level length but because it would be a bit more fun to replay, and easier to stomach a 45 minute run instead of a 2 hour one. This isn't the sort of game a person works through once and sets it on a(n Xbox 360 dashboard) shelf forever. And is it really that much better being about an hour longer than most good arcade action games (and previous Contra games)? |
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Post by derboo on Feb 17, 2011 18:28:36 GMT -5
Also, it wouldn't have been impossible (though more work, of course) to have different versions of the stages for each mode.
I'm liking it more with subsequent playthroughs (of the demo, only. Not gonna buy it before it goes on sale in a couple of months). The inability to turn around while crouching, though, can get really annoying, indeed. Especially since you have to wait until the getting-up animation ends before you can turn around again.
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Post by Discoalucard on Feb 17, 2011 20:12:39 GMT -5
Like in Uprising's case, why distribute lives in certain areas, or give you a more powerful version of a weapon when collected twice, Because they expect the player to die a lot and need replenishments. But it's still too hard apparently? That's not to say they don't give props for doing well. I actually love that the scoring is tied with the money system, since you are rewarded for being ace. But it seems more like it was done with the Uprising Mode in mind, and the Arcade mode sorta tacked on to satisfy those gamers. I do like that both audiences are being served, at least. |
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