Miyamoto: "I never said games are art."

[Jave]

Yeah, I would put Limbo in the "Story? What story? Just play the effing game already!" category.

I like that category. It gets to the point.

[Ryu the Grappler]

Jun 18, 2011 1:29:56 GMT -5 Malroth said:

Surprised Limbo wasnt mentioned anywhere in here yet. The storyline is next to non-existent, and is one of those "interpret it yourself" deals. Frankly, I think using that device is an extremely lazy way of telling the story, since the gamer is essentially writing the story himself. It also seems to me anything thats obviously open to interpretation becomes "WHOAMG AWESOEM!" as far as critics are concerned.

.

I mentioned it a page ago, when Michael Thomsen (the same creepy manchild who called Metroid Prime Trilogy "the Citizen Kane of gaming") compared Super Mario Galaxy 2 unfavorably to it and whine about how "video games need to grow up". His complains about Galaxy 2 were mostly unnecessary whining about the game's difficulty.

What's least satisfying about Galaxy 2 is that all its puzzles are designed to be solved.

xboxlive.ign.com/articles/111/1112171p2.html
As opposed to puzzles that solve themselves?

There's nothing special about Limbo. It's a simplified action-puzzle game with shadowy graphics that are just an excuse to not use any colors besides black, white and shades of gray under the pretense that they're "stylish" (and probably to target the game to Hot Topic-shopping emo hipsters).

I also have to correct my statements that sound like a game has to be a good game to be a good piece of game-art. Shadow of the Colossus to me was a terrible, annoying chore to play, but it effectively made a statement by making players to go out and work hard (even moreso for people like me, who didn't have any fun with the gameplay at all) to slaughter all those wonderful creatures to achieve their perceived goal, only to show them later what kind of monsters "they" have become.

I never played Shadow of the Colossus, so I never got caught in all of its critical hype, but from the way you're describing, it sounds like it's a barely above-average action game with a cool environment and an original scenario.

[Jave]

Jun 18, 2011 9:36:31 GMT -5 Ryu the Grappler said:

There's nothing special about Limbo. It's a simplified action-puzzle game with shadowy graphics that are just an excuse to not use any colors besides black, white and shades of gray under the pretense than they're "stylish" (and probably to target the game to Hot Topic-shopping emo hipsters).

I think that's a rather disparaging way of putting it, but not entirely incorrect either. It's a style choice, there's really no need to think about it beyond that. I'm glad that some games look different than others, but aesthetics are just part of what makes a game.

(I hated braid, incidentally. The only things I'll give it props for were the watercolours and the music.)

[TheChosen]

I really dislike some of the indy games that try to be too "artsy". It usually kills much of the playability. Sure, its great if games evoke emotions from players (seriously, there should be more games that do that) or deliver important messages, but entertaining the player should always be number one, no matter if you have a budget or not.

I think Lume is a good example of a good "artsy game". Its as charming as hell, and the puzzles are diabolical.

[robertagilmour]

Jun 18, 2011 9:36:31 GMT -5 Ryu the Grappler said:

I never played Shadow of the Colossus, so I never got caught in all of its critical hype, but from the way you're describing, it sounds like it's a barely above-average action game with a cool environment and an original scenario.

I never played it either but I watched friends play it and it had some awe-inspiring boss fights. Another game that I really dont get people calling "arty-farty" because it had mostly traditional values of games. I admired that it lacked a lot of things that some bigger developers might have put in it, lots of stupid cutscenes with melodramatic voice acting, overdone weapon/magic systems that didnt need to be there and design your own swooshy haircut and clothes with a million accessories.

I think the Mario Galaxy games were incredible, but the difficulty put me off. It was a bit too hardcore a Nintendo game for me, haha.

[derboo]

Jun 18, 2011 9:36:31 GMT -5 Ryu the Grappler said:

I never played Shadow of the Colossus, so I never got caught in all of its critical hype, but from the way you're describing, it sounds like it's a barely above-average action game with a cool environment and an original scenario.

Fighting most of the enemies in Shadow of the Colossus is kinda like climbing a tower in Assassin's Creed, only much slower. And the tower is moving, so there's often long stretches when you can't move at all.

[Feynman]

Maybe so, but it turns out that Extreme Freestyle Moving Tower Climbing is actually really fun!

[derboo]

It also turns out that it is actually really boring.

[kyouki]

Jun 18, 2011 9:36:31 GMT -5 Ryu the Grappler said:

I never played Shadow of the Colossus, so I never got caught in all of its critical hype, but from the way you're describing, it sounds like it's a barely above-average action game with a cool environment and an original scenario.

I tried playing the game multiple times and couldn't get past the poor frame rate and frustrating controls. I like what they tried to do and it would probably make a really great game in more competent hands (or possibly on a more powerful system). Too bloated and poorly-made for me to consider it art though.

[caoslayer]

More "competent" hands would had added random enemies, infinitive side quests and lots of stupid cutscenes. A better framerate would be nice, I cant wait for the ps3 version.

I had lots of fun and even it took me about 10 hours to finish it and after that, replaying it several times with the time trials.

I feel you have been playing another game with the same name.

[robertagilmour]

I think these are more technical issues than the artistic direction being called into question.

[megatronbison]

SotC is a bloated game?
Man, people sure are weird- I thought it ended before it got too dragged out. If you want bloated try FFXIII- Shadow tells a better story in 10 hours with minimal cutscenes than FFXIII tells over 40+ hours of agony.

[Ike]

How could you possibly call SotC bloated? The core gameplay and story are about as minimalist as you could get for the genre. You never even see the only character with any dialogue.

[ldorado]

I'd hate to enter this realm, but before 2000, most eroge WERE actual games. You just had to work hard to earn your porno scenes. Nowadays, they're all visual novels that just require nothing more than flipping through pages and dialogue to get to those H scenes. In fact, they're hardly games anymore. I think this is a case where the art became more important than the game itself and discarded the game aspect entirely. Sure, naked chicks are fun and all, but I think some of our friends in Japan miss having to work for their prizes.