Let's Talk Samurai Shodown

[Discoalucard]

So, I think I'd like to start on a Samurai Shodown article. However, I'm not entirely as well versed in it as King of Fighters. But that article worked really well with a bunch of people contributing, so let's try it again, I guess! Ultimately I'd love to have a Summer of SNK, and get up for articles for this, Last Blade, Fatal Fury, Savage Reign/Kizuna Encounter, World Heroes and Art of Fighting. That might be a bit overambitious though.

SS1: One of the first weapon based fighters. One of the most popular since it was ported to so many systems, even though Earthquake is missing from most of them. The main boss was Amakusa.

SS2: Widely regarded as one of the best fighting games ever made, if mostly because it's the most balanced, and doesn't include any of the "improvements" of later games that ended up making things worse. Added in Cham Cham, Caffeine Nicotine, Reinhardt Seiger and Genjuro, the "rival" for Haohmaru. The boss is Mizuki (ARGH). Barely got any home ports though, besides a Windows PC release and a version for the Playstation.

SS3: Kind of a minor reinvention, changed the control system to emphasive sword attacks over kicks. Adds air-blocking and moves that sound kind of like KoF tactical rolls. Removed a bunch of old favorite characters but added a few new faces like that umbrella kid (forget his name), Rimuru, Basara (I think he came in here), and Amakusa as a regular character. The boss is Zankuro. I've played maybe five minutes of this so this is the one I'm sketchiest on. I know the PSOne release came to American and had ridiculous load times. Apparently this one is much darker graphically than the rest, according to Wikipedia? I really can't see this, the first two were dark as well. Also introduced the Bust/Slash variations, which kinda made up for the slim character roster.

SS4: Gets rid of the some of the sketchier "enhancements" of SS3 like the air blocking, and readds some old characters like Charlotte and Jubei. I know there are some new characters like that fire guy, and the boss is Amakusa once again. Generally just a less broken version of SS3, I guess. Also has the cool suicide manuevers. I have the Saturn version, and there's still a bunch of annoying slowdown. The PSOne version is apparently worse but adds Cham Cham in two player mode.

SS5: Created by Yuki Enterprises. Ditches the Slash/Bust system, but separates some of the entities in their own characters. Control systems has been changed again to make one of the buttons the "dodge" button. New characters include that white haired bow/arrow girl Mina (and her stupid little animal friend), that giant beast Kuso-something, that guy with the wacky haircut Yoshitora (I think?) and that old Chinese martial arts guy. The boss is Gaoh. Lots of mixed opinions on this one, it seems. Some people hate it, while others think it's okay, even though it's not SS2 level. Apparently it's really unbalanced? There's also this power called Concentration One which slows down time, but I've never used it.

SS5 Special: Refined version of SS5 with new backgrounds and playable bosses from all previous SS games. Was scheduled for a PS2 port in Japan but got canned. Last Neo Geo game ever.

SS6 / SS Tenka: "Dream match" for the Atomiswave featuring every character in the series plus a few new ones, including a bishounen version of Andrew Jackson, a blade-wielding maid, and something that appears to be a sentient puppet stage (??) Allows you to pick six different "spirits", which are sort of like Grooves from Capcom Vs SNK, that determiens the play system - each are based off a previous game in the series. The game is way too bright and happy, and much of the atmosphere of the previous games is gone.

I'll have to skip the Hyper 64 titles for now, since they're not emulated. I would love to get the board, but that's not financially feasible at the moment. The Playstation title is actually a completely new game, technically the third 3D game, and is apparently total trash.

There's also Samurai Shodown RPG, which I have for the PSOne, and is really quite slow.

So not counting the portable games, that's pretty much it.

A few general questions - first, is there anything major that really separates Samurai Shodown from Last Blade? I mean, other than the atmosphere and the countering system, they both seem pretty similar.

Second, most of the games use the POW system, right? As in, you take damage, and eventually turn red. I know your offense is stregthened, but I've heard your defense is weakened. Is this true? Also, I've never figured out the super moves in any Samurai Shodown, is this how they've executed?

Finally, what's the deal with the "fatalities"? I know in SS1 and 2, if you land a heavy slash on an opponent to finish them, you'll either create a fountain of blood or chop them in half. But later games (like SS4 and SS5 Special" brag about fatalities, are these the same thing?

[MRSKELETON]

SS4 Is my favorite out of all of them.
I like the whole, when you kil them they-get-impaled-with-their-own-sword thing

[Deleted]

Let's talk SS? Yes, let's! ;D

I don't have much fun time at the moment, so let me be concise. I do believe that it is this game that made me a rabid SNK fan, with SS2 being my absolute fave. SS4 comes really close, but all the others rule as well... and dammit, I wanna play the SS64 games! HANZO AND GENJURO OWN YOU ALL. Victoly!

I may be a bit more detailed later, but I probably should get a bit of work in...

... eh, screw that. I'll oblige you on a few names and questions...

Umbrella Kid = Shizumaru. I think he's the son of Zankuro, but I'm not totally sure on that one. He's pretty damn cool for a young'un, although the computer does tend to abuse his irritating uppercut move.

Rimuru is actually Rimururu.

Don't forget that Gaira first came along in SS3 as well. They needed a big guy to fill in the humongous void that Earthquake left with his departure.

Fire Guy = Kazuki. That would make Sogetsu the "water guy."

Giant Beast = Kusaregedo. For some reason, not very many people like him. I kinda do, but he's bleedin' difficult to play as.

Old Chinese Martial Arts Guy = Yunfei. Yes, he is more than likely based heavily from Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon.

Blade-wielding Maid = Iroha. More than likely the subject of much hentai lately... not that I'd know.

Stage Puppet Thingy = Ocha-Maru. What the fux is up with this thing?! I cannot explain it... but it certainly is original.

Another new character in Tenka is a muscley fella named Sugoroku who has what seems to be a giant cannon (!) as his weapon.

As to your questions...

1. Samurai Shodown and Last Blade are far from being similar, IMO. The mechanics are just so different, what with LB offering both a Power and Speed mode. LB is more combo-friendly, while most games in SS emphasize mindgames and keeping your opponent guessing. Plus, the characters are just so different (and awesome)... I... don't really know how else to explain it. Though, I don't think you can disarm anybody in LB.

2. I have no idea if your defense lowers in POW mode, but your offense certainly increases. I was playing SSV Special lately, and with a pissed-off Genjuro, I drained 90% of my opponent's life with a single freaking slash! I then murdered his ass with the fatality... BOOYAH! As for super moves, they're not around in the first SS. The only benefit of POW is better offensive power. It also builds up rather slowly. It accumulates quicker in SS2, and you can see the command for your character's super move above the POW bar. Same thing for SS3, but in this game, you can actually charge up the power bar a la early King of Fighters, and if your health is in the red, you have permanent POW until the round is ended. In SS4, the POW bar basically works as it does in SS2, only you can also receive increased power through the Rage Explosion (pressing A+B+C). How long the RE lasts depends on how much life you have left. If you have very little, it will last much longer. Plus, you're allowed to do a hyper-powerful Issen slash in the RE that can potentially decimate all of your opponent's lifebar. I'm not sure if you can do it in the RE, but in POW mode, the universal command for super moves is (Away, Toward, Down+A+B). This system is basically how it is in SS5 and SS5 Special, only A. the command for every character is now (Down, Down/Toward, Toward+C+D) and B. certain characters build their rage faster than others. I... can't tell you how it works for SS Tenka. Haven't played it yet. *WHEW!*

C. Fatalities in the original SS were random, but they generally occur if you end with a fierce slash. Either your enemies would A. Fly backward (lame), 2. stand still and have a heap big gout of blood leap out, or C. split open and coins would fly out of their corpses! In SS2, this is also how it works, only A. Your opponent could stand still and have their torso slowly slide off of the rest of their body, or B. If you split them open, an item pertaining to their personality would fly out instead of coins! Items like Sake jugs for Haohmaru, bullet shells for Sieger, Hanafuda cards for Genjuro, and entire roast turkeys from Earthquake! Unfortunately, this couldn't be done with blunt weapons. Sorry, Wan-Fu users! The fatalities were basically like they were for SS2 in SS3, only to add with the darker and more realistic tone, items would no longer fly out of their body. Drag. In SS4, they had actual fatalities. The set-up for them happens somewhat randomly, but you can increase your chances if you finish the opponent in twenty seconds or less on the last round and you hold A as you deliver the final blow. Oh, and they have to be on the ground. The fatality command is (Down, Down, Up, Toward, Toward+C). Many characters have cool ones... except for Nakoruru's, where her opponent isn't left with only half their body at the end of it. Dang. Fatalities were removed in SS5, sadly, but they make a glorious return in SSV Special, where you have to get your opponent down to the last quarter of their lifebar (the dark green/blue part), activate the Rage Explosion with A+B+C, and do this command: (Down, Down/Away, Away+C+D). Behold the awesome violence! The finishers of Basara and Kusaregedo are especially brutal, if you ask me, though they're all awesome. In SS Tenka... you can't kill anyone anymore. There isn't even any blood, which is a heap big ripoff.

And do take care to mention the hilarious butchering of the English language. For my money, the epitome of SNKgrish is found within the SS series. Just take my current sig with Bust Hanzo! ZUKES! *LOL*

[joesteele]

admin said:

Ultimately I'd love to have a Summer of SNK, and get up for articles for this, Last Blade, Fatal Fury, Savage Reign/Kizuna Encounter, World Heroes and Art of Fighting.

What about Metal Slug? Athena? Psycho Solider? Ikari Warriors? Crystalis? Or is this just SNK's fighting game contingent?

[sainttweeter]

Don't forget Suija and Enja, who are basicly like evil demon versions of Sogetsu and Kazama, and Rera, who is basicly just Bust version of Nakoruru but 100% superior and cuter, who were added in SS5. Mina, Yunfei, and Yoshitaka were all created by the Ruroni Kenshin character designer, I think. >_>

[ed]

I have the whole series besides the last two on AES (with a second copy of III for the Saturn). Looks nice on the shelf, but I suck terribly at fighting games so they don't get much playtime.

SSIII has some rabid fans out there. The characters are bigger...maybe I don't know what's going on here, but the pause after pretty much every hit is annoying.

As for "darker," well, some of the stages are pretty much a single color (with different shades) of background. Probably an impression from the first stage.

[recap]

"1. Samurai Shodown and Last Blade are far from being similar, IMO. The mechanics are just so different, what with LB offering both a Power and Speed mode. LB is more combo-friendly, while most games in SS emphasize mindgames and keeping your opponent guessing. Plus, the characters are just so different (and awesome)... I... don't really know how else to explain it. Though, I don't think you can disarm anybody in LB."

I agree. Though you can disarm your opponent in Gekka no Kenshi (I'm sorry the Western name is so... uninspired). I'd sum it up by saying that Samurai Spirits is to Gekka no Kenshi what SFII is to SFIII.




"SS2: Widely regarded as one of the best fighting games ever made, if mostly because it's the most balanced, and doesn't include any of the "improvements" of later games that ended up making things worse."

I'm not sure if SSS is really well balanced, but I find that if it succeeded that much was thanks, especially, to its audiovisual design. SSS has some of the most beautiful sprites and backgrounds ever made on any game, and, more importantly, their variety, size and animation for a 1994 game. Of course, having such a well-tuned gameplay was also essential, but without those graphics, it wouldn't have served much.


Also, I do think that Zankurou Musouken added the true obscurity to the series. Not for the good, if you ask me.

[Neo Rasa]

ed if you hate SSIII so much I'd be more than happy to take it off your hands. I'm one of those rabid fans.

[ed]

Well, in all fairness I think it's got some good ideas. I don't hate it, if you got that impression - I just have had even less time with it than the other games (if that's possible)

That should change once I get that pad. See, it's not my idea of fun to haul around AES games, open up the AES box, get everything to a TV and play with it - especially when I was so careful to buy high-condition games.

[kyouki]

admin said:

SS5 Special: Refined version of SS5 with new backgrounds and playable bosses from all previous SS games. Was scheduled for a PS2 port in Japan but got canned. Last Neo Geo game ever.

I wish they had ported SSVSpecial rather than SSTK. SSVSpecial is really awesome from what I played, and it continues the atmosphere of the SS series perfectly.

[Neo Rasa]

Yeah ed once you put some time into SSIII it may grow on you. The visual and sonic variety alone is really impressive (every background has a "dark" version for when each character has a win and the match is close to an end, there's a background for every single character, etc.). Very atmospheric soundtrack too when compared to the first two SS games.

Gameplay-wise it has a sort of meta-balance to it. Everyone is so obscenely powerful that it ends up equalizing the playing field (something MvC2 is often credited with being a "new type of fighting game" for doing) if that makes sense.

[Sac (a.k.a Icaras)]

I was looking at SNK Playmore's US site the other day, and from that it would appear that Samurai Shodown V was only released for the X-Box, which sucks as I've been wanting a copy for PS2 ever since I saw a preview for it on KOF: Maximum Impact.


I suppose there's always emulation, but...bleh. Fighting games just aren't the same on a PC and with a keyboard, IMO. (I could get a gamepad for my PC, but I hardly ever play games on my PC these days, so it'd be a waste of money)

[Shadax]

This is a bit of an aside, but I think the Neo Geo Pocket Color deserves it's own article. Provided I get my new apartment (I'll find out this evening) I plan on buying one with most of the iconic games, and would be more than happy to provide a write-up.

I know it bucks the traditional layout of the site (going by series) but I think it deserves more of a focus on the notable games on the system rather than a quick aside on a series page.

[Discoalucard]

I certainly wouldn't be against an article focusing on the NGPC. It's focus was rather limited, but it's a nice system, and whatever games it put out during it's life span was far better than the dreck for the Gameboy Color. The screen is superior than the original GBA too, even though it's still not backlit.

Anyway Samurai Shodown 5 came out for the PS2 in Japan but SCEA blocked it's release in America so it only came out for the Xbox. The ports are identical for all intents and purposes, but the Xbox version actually translates the story scenes, making it superior than the English Neo Geo version.

Anyone willing to pitch in character descriptions when the time comes? I think I'm gonna get all of the portraits from Tenka, since it's mostly complete, even if the art lacks the edge of the Neo Geo games. I'm gonna have to skip on the Hyper 64 games as mentioned earlier, but maybe put in entries for Asura and Shiki. And maybe that one guy with the glasses that was in Samurai Shodown! 2 for the NGPC. Was he in any other game?

[Deleted]

admin said:

I certainly wouldn't be against an article focusing on the NGPC. It's focus was rather limited, but it's a nice system, and whatever games it put out during it's life span was far better than the dreck for the Gameboy Color. The screen is superior than the original GBA too, even though it's still not backlit.

Anyway Samurai Shodown 5 came out for the PS2 in Japan but SCEA blocked it's release in America so it only came out for the Xbox. The ports are identical for all intents and purposes, but the Xbox version actually translates the story scenes, making it superior than the English Neo Geo version.

Anyone willing to pitch in character descriptions when the time comes? I think I'm gonna get all of the portraits from Tenka, since it's mostly complete, even if the art lacks the edge of the Neo Geo games. I'm gonna have to skip on the Hyper 64 games as mentioned earlier, but maybe put in entries for Asura and Shiki. And maybe that one guy with the glasses that was in Samurai Shodown! 2 for the NGPC. Was he in any other game?

A. An NGPC article would be tops! I must admit that SNK vs. Capcom: Match of the Millenium is all varieties of awesome.

B. But I guess that the SSV port for the XBOX doesn't have the refined mechanics of SSV Special?

C. Character descriptions! Got it! ;D

But I can't do any now... I should be doing homework. But all I'm doing is listening to Dream Theater and contemplating how awesome Gyakuten Saiban 2 is going to be... which I've been doing for about an hour or so. Work time is now.