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Post by susanismyalias on Nov 19, 2010 10:35:11 GMT -5
One hundred ports of Ys I and II will bring about the apocalypse.
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Post by wyrdwad on Nov 19, 2010 12:30:20 GMT -5
Yeah, it would pretty much be Falcom's decision to port their games to other consoles... and Hudson's decision to release TG-16 Ys III (or IV, for that matter) on Virtual Console. All we can do is prod, and we can't really do a LOT of that or else the developers might get annoyed at us. (:
-Tom
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Post by sideshow on Nov 19, 2010 15:10:01 GMT -5
It makes sense that this series went to the PSP given that the japanese culture thinks small is better. I just think bringing these games over to the west would of gave them more of a wide audience exposure if they would of been on the virtual console, xbox live arcade, or PSN. I think most of the people born after 1990 probably dont even know what the hell the Ys series is all about unless they were lucky enough to be exposed to it when Ark of Napishtim came out for the PS2 and PSP a few years back.
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Post by 9inchsamurai on Nov 19, 2010 15:46:02 GMT -5
Ok, I'm showing up late to everything, but I promise I won't dwell on this. how come every time someone pirates a game it's the first thing they mention? Then it completely derails the thread into this same stupid discussion over and over again. The only reason I mentioned it is because I already stated earlier that I couldn't afford to buy it. I wanted to talk about the game, but I wouldn't feel comfortable doing it without having to qualify how I played the game. In retrospect, I shouldn't have said anything. One thing I'm curious about is that Ys III seems to have the fan-favorite soundtrack. Now, I especially like some of the songs on its soundtrack ("Searing Struggle" and "Valestein Castle" especially), but from what I've heard of the other games I don't think Ys III has the best. For example, almost every track in Ys 7 is ridiculously good, and just about every dungeon track in Ys I is also really good. As for the porting to modern systems, I could see it happening on PSN because it already has some precedent with the TG16. Don't really see that happening for XBLA though. |
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Post by MRSKELETON on Nov 19, 2010 15:51:42 GMT -5
chibi graphics turn me off, i still can't bring myself to play earlier Ys games because of the art aesthetics
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Post by wyrdwad on Nov 19, 2010 17:08:28 GMT -5
The entire Ys series has ridiculously good music, and for me, it is a really tough call... but I think I prefer Ys III's soundtrack to Seven's, I & II's, or any other Ys game's. But it's VERY close. IMHO, III/Oath is on top by a VERY SMALL MARGIN, followed closely by Seven, I, II, and IV (all of which are pretty much tied). (: Origin is a close third, VI a close fourth, and V definitely my least-favorite (though even V's soundtrack is great, it just doesn't feel very Ys-ish to me).
-Tom
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Post by kitten on May 6, 2011 4:53:51 GMT -5
Decided to buy Oath in Felghana on a whim when I saw a premium edition available at GameStop for only $30 (it's funny how having a job makes $30 seem like considerably less). I already posted that I got it in the latest purchase thread, but I figured that I'd elaborate a bit, here. An ARPG seemed like the perfect kind of game to fit into the two and a half hours before I start my shift that I'm stuck at work because of having to ride in early with my roommate (we work at the same place, but he's the one with the car). An action game would be something I wouldn't be able to relax and play, and a straight-up RPG like Strange Journey just seemed like it would be too slow for me to feel I was getting into it while at work.
Ys was right there at the Portal 2 midnight release (which I wasn't there to buy, actually, I was just dropping by with my roommate) at Gamestop, and it had a pretty looking box at ordinary box price, so I just went for it. I've been playing it a couple hours 3 out of 7 days of the week, and pacing it like this has given me a really great opportunity to enjoy my first experience with the series and ponder about the mechanics about it rather than plowing through it and making an immediate judgment. The art, atmosphere and structure of the game seems to suggest this is really the best kind of way to pace the game, as there's a lot of it to take in and enjoy.
Anyway, how the game actually plays - the game's combat is fast-paced and really addictive. This seriously does wonders for the game, considering that it helps alleviate boring dungeon crawling with fast-paced hack n' slash action. There's an abundance of bosses that all have creative, interesting attack patterns and the game really does a great job of never getting stale while keeping itself from becoming overbearingly complicated. ARPG's often teeter dangerously on the scale of "too complicated" or "too simple," and Ys finds a great balance by keeping the RPG elements simple and the action deep.
That said, the lack of a lock-on button seems kind of mysterious. One of the shoulder buttons could have easily taken this up. I often end up attacking the wrong enemy or wailing into an invincible portion of a boss (or, worse yet, an invincible portion of a boss that damages me when I collide Adol into it). I don't think it was really all that much to ask for, and given that the game is really based on chaining lots of hits together, it seems kind of ridiculous that there's no way to lock on.
The leveling mechanics are a pretty nice way of providing incentive to explore, but on the difficulty I'm playing on (hard), they also lend themselves to encouraging you to exploit them by leaving the best room to grind in and then repeatedly re-entering it and clearing the bad guys out. Difficulty balancing is also done rather strangely. Getting better equipment or leveling up even a single time makes a dungeon play much differently, and drastically effects boss fights. It makes it hard for me to find a sweet spot for where to be when I fight a boss, because I seem to be stuck always "almost killing them" before a level or two, then beating them on my first or second try after that level up.
Not to say that leveling breaks the game, but it just seems like they could have done a better job with balancing things out. There's never been any point where I could just walk through the game with completely zero challenge, at least, which is more than I can say for most games with RPG elements. Boss fights, although unbalanced and reliant upon your level for how difficult they actually are (it's nearly impossible to play in a way reliably enough to just never get hit), are always fresh and entertaining. Each boss so far has also been very vividly rendered with a superb attention to detail, which gets major plus points in my book. They're all unique, interesting moments in the game, and there's definitely no lack of them.
The attention to detail in the bosses is shared in the game's general atmosphere, too. While the game definitely has a somewhat minimal approach to story, it really, truly benefits from that with strong character designs, an interesting plot with good lore, an amazingly good soundtrack, and just a general attention to detail and care put into the game that you rarely see. The whole Ys universe is really easy to indulge yourself in, and the way the story is told allows you to paint your own picture of Adol without him coming across as a bland and boring silent protagonist.
It's a really lush game in a lot of ways, and it does so in a way that's very unpretentious. It manages to never get its head up its own ass while simultaneously having a really splendid sense of grandeur. I don't normally enjoy fantasy settings, but Oath in Felghana really nails a lot of what I like about fantasy in all the right ways. I really feel like I can sort of imagine what it's like to be in the world of Ys when I play, which is a sense I get incredibly rarely from any sort of media, these days.
The localization also helps a lot. Almost all of the voice acting is well done (aside from the woman in the blacksmith's shop and the hotel owner, who both speak much too slowly in an attempt to bring out the accents of the characters) and everything is translated in a really delightful way. I don't mean to blow smoke up Wyrdwad's ass, but he's giving Atlus more than a run for their money in doing a truly superb job of making sure that everything in the game (aside from the "bwa ha ha" in the description of a difficulty) really feels completely professional.
Anyway, to put it shortly, I'm really impressed with about everything, but I feel like there should have been a lock-on button and better balancing. Maybe a map feature, too, as trying to find gems (which are very very very important) can be difficult to do when you need to backtrack for them.
Edit: I typed this all up hoping it would help me feel like I could sleep, but it's NOT WORKING AUGHHH why can't my rapid thinking have an off switch
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Post by Feynman on May 6, 2011 14:48:03 GMT -5
I'm happy to hear that you're enjoying Oath! I agree that the tipping point between being underleveled versus a boss and being too strong is pretty narrow. That's been an ongoing issue for the entire Ys series, and probably the one thing that most needs improvement. I don't think the game needs any kind of lock-on, though. Learning to control Adol's blazing speed with pinpoint accuracy accounts for a great deal of the combat's depth, and lock-on combat would actively work against that.
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Post by wyrdwad on May 6, 2011 14:56:37 GMT -5
Awesome, thanks for the detailed review (and the kind words!). (:
I never really thought of the idea of Ys with a lock-on button, TBH, but I can kinda see where you're coming from. I don't think a lock-on button is strictly NECESSARY, nor would I be likely to use it if it existed... but as an optional feature, it certainly couldn't hurt. It's an interesting idea, at the very least!
Regarding the level-up mechanics, Falcom has done some interesting experimentation with leveling and stat progression before (see: Zwei for leveling and Sorcerian for stat progression), but has always kept things pretty basic with Ys. Basically, if you play an Ys game normally, on Normal difficulty, without paying attention to your leveling AT ALL, you should always be pretty much exactly where you need to be. If you ever get stuck, though, you can always grind a level or two, and that should be enough to help you get UNstuck.
It's not an ideal solution, but it works just fine, as you've noted. It might be interesting to see Falcom bring some of their creative leveling from the Zwei games (where you're rewarded for staying low-level as long as possible, and the game is theoretically finishable at level 1 if you're a total badass) into Ys at some point, though.
Or maybe I just really want another Zwei game, I dunno. (:
-Tom
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Post by Ike on May 6, 2011 17:21:41 GMT -5
The description for Inferno difficulty is "Welcome to Hell. Population: You"
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Post by kitten on May 6, 2011 21:37:49 GMT -5
I'm happy to hear that you're enjoying Oath! I am, too! I'm really pleasantly surprised with the series. I'm more interested in checking out the rest of Falcom's library, now, and am almost certainly going to purchase a premium edition Ys 7 once I've finished up Oath. My battery ran out while playing today at work, just after I got the 3rd bracelet from Dogi. It seems to be really picking up the pace, now, and I hope I've got at least another 5 hours left before I finish it. I started out very impressed, but the game's easily leaning toward me giving it a 5-star rating on Backloggery now that I've gotten in full-swing and understand the importance of leveling and equipment. Awesome, thanks for the detailed review (and the kind words!). (: Absolutely! I'm really surprised at how much I'm enjoying the game (and how much I'm now interested in the series), and I think the positive impression is definitely impacted by how well the localization was done. I'm going to be starting Inferno difficulty as soon as I finish my run, and then, as mentioned, am also going to buy Ys 7 as soon as I get a chance. I'm a little bit more hesitant toward getting Ys 1&2, as I'm worried Ys 1 might be a little too clunky and archaic for me. Also interested in trying out Ark of Napishtem (is that spelled correctly? I don't have time to google it on my work break lol), even if I hear that it's basically just like a weaker OiF. |
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Post by Ike on May 6, 2011 22:49:27 GMT -5
I'm a little bit more hesitant toward getting Ys 1&2, as I'm worried Ys 1 might be a little too clunky and archaic for me. Also interested in trying out Ark of Napishtem (is that spelled correctly? I don't have time to google it on my work break lol), even if I hear that it's basically just like a weaker OiF. I'm playing both Ark of Napisht im and Ys 1 right now. Here's my thoughts on both: Ys 1: Definitely old school. The combat's very weak although charging into enemies has some charm to it and it does require at least a little thought to avoid taking damage. The bosses are some of the worst I've ever seen in a video game, which is strange for this series. I just fought the Vampire, who spends 90% of the battle in an invulnerable state in the form of a cloud of bats that chase you incessantly across the board, have mostly random flight patterns, and can easily damage you. I have the best armor available to me and I am at the max level and playing on Easy mode, so that should tell you something. The window of opportunity to hit the Vampire when he does reform into his body is so unbelievably small that you have to be right next to him to land a single hit, which means getting eaten alive by the bat cloud. There's also very little in the way of direction as far as plot advancement goes. The world map is very tiny so it mostly involves just wandering around til you happen upon a plot event. All of the plot advancing items are found in random, nondescript chests in the dungeons. It boils down to that you have to explore literally everything to advance -- but this upsets me less with this game than it would on another Zelda-style game. On the positive side, the game is gorgeous and the 2D spritework is fantastic. The music is great, the overworld looks very organic, the character designs are fantastic, and most of all, the localization saves this game from mediocrity. Ys 1 is worth playing if only for the atmosphere and the history; it's also quite short from what I understand and it's possible to blow through it in a day of dedicated play (maybe consulting a guide.) Ark of Napishtim: This game is something of a mixed bag. On the one hand, it reminds me a lot of OiF. On the other hand, it reminds me a lot of OiF. Let me explain. The controls aren't nearly as responsive as OiF's are. This might be because I'm playing on an HDTV (and thus a short lag time), but Adol's jumps are ludicrously delayed for how precise some the platforming demands you to be. I spent over an hour today trying to perform a "dash-jump," a mechanic explained nowhere in the game itself and very poorly explained in both my strategy guide and the internet, but a technique that's absolutely essential to getting some pretty important treasure chests in one of the mid-game dungeons. You are required to dash-jump across about 6 platforms in rapid succession without fucking up or falling or getting shot by an unavoidable laser in this shit dungeon: Fuck the Ruins of Amnesia. Combining the sheer number of pitfalls with ridiculously overpowered enemies was a really bad idea for this game, because apparently this is the dungeon where a lot of people give up on the game entirely. The most irritating enemies are the small laser-shooting pods that are rooted to the ground scattered throughout the dungeon. These wouldn't be so bad except that the lasers fire instantly and (once again, because of delayed jumping) are ludicrously hard to dodge and getting hit by even a single laser that does 2 damage to you can be devastating, because there's a 101% chance it's going to knock you into a pit and you'll have to redo the entire fucking thing a;lsgnalsjgnpoef Multiply this by 50. I've had more trouble with this stupid platforming than I've had with any of the bosses in any Ys game, including Galbalan on Inferno in OiF. The music is pretty good overall. It's a little repetitive but it hasn't grated on my nerves yet and I find myself humming along with it a lot. Same for the graphics, the game's fairly easy to navigate and the areas all look unique and detailed. The characters all look good and some of them have amazing artwork portraits, but for some reason most of them appear extremely blurry and artifacted on my system and I'm not sure why that is. It only seems to affect certain portraits. I wish there were some magical way that XSEED could republish an upgraded PSP version of this game. I feel like it could really be a great entry in the Ys series, but it's so sorely lacking in polish. The localization is bland and lifeless and the VA is pretty much awful all around. I would love to see it get the Wyrdwad treatment it deserves. Overall I think AoN is worth playing but it's a hard pill to swallow after the greatness that was OiF and Seven. |
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Post by wyrdwad on May 6, 2011 23:44:04 GMT -5
To be fair, we realized how obtuse Ys I is, and thus included a full walkthrough for the entire game in the back of the instruction manual. So Kitten, if you buy a physical copy of the game (or the North American PSN version), you should be able to get through it without any trouble.
The real star of Ys I & II Chronicles, though, is Ys II. It's an improvement upon the first game in every regard, and quite possibly one of the best games in the series. Though I do think Ys Seven is more accessible, and would still recommend giving that (and possibly Ark) a try before picking up Chronicles.
Just be warned: Seven is a different beast, difficulty-wise. Whereas Felghana is probably the hardest game in the series, Seven is possibly the easiest. You'll enjoy the combat, I think... but don't expect the same sort of challenge, save for a few select instances.
-Tom
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Post by Ike on May 7, 2011 0:38:56 GMT -5
Is there any way you can convince the Falcom gods to remake Ys 6?
Please? ;~;
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Post by wyrdwad on May 7, 2011 1:13:41 GMT -5
I'm sure it'll happen one day, but the likelihood of it happening anytime in the foreseeable future is virtually nil. Fan demand for remakes of Ys IV and V far outweighs demand for a remake of VI (besides which, the PS2 version is actually quite good!), and I think an HD remake/port of Ys Seven, a port of Ys Origin and/or an Ys 8 are far more likely to come before Ys VI ever gets touched again.
-Tom
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