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Post by Feynman on Aug 6, 2014 19:58:19 GMT -5
Guacamelee really is excellent.
Even the game's name is delightful.
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Post by Digitalnametag on Aug 6, 2014 20:02:30 GMT -5
Hate to be cheap and dethrone a classic with another game in the series, but A Link Between Worlds surpasses the greatness that is A Link to the Past. The perfect 2D Zelda game for newcomers to the series. ALBW was some of the most fun I've had gaming in recent years. I've never understood what people see in Circle of the Moon. Could you elaborate? Yeah if we are naming Castlevania games better than SotN I'd go with either Aria or Dawn of Sorrow. I really enjoyed the Soul system in those games. The Reverse Castle in SotN kills the final portion of the game for me. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2014 20:02:40 GMT -5
Guacamelee looks like a cheap Flash animation to me. I would have much preferred lush, hand-drawn pixel art of the kind seen in SotN. The title is a middle school-level pun, and no game after Smash should be allowed to use "melee" in its title.
To contribute more to the thread, I will say that Bionic Commando Rearmed is better than the NES original, even if the new final stage is a sleep-inducing gauntlet of "wait and go" obstacles.
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Post by nightdreamer on Aug 6, 2014 20:09:31 GMT -5
Oh man if you think Guacamelee is cheap Flash animation, you've clearly never sat down and tried to draw vector art yourself. And are you incapable of letting people have a favorite game that doesn't align with your own? Stop taking yourself so seriously, man.
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Post by Bobinator on Aug 6, 2014 20:18:54 GMT -5
Guacamelee looks like a cheap Flash animation to me. I would have much preferred lush, hand-drawn pixel art of the kind seen in SotN. The title is a middle school-level pun, and no game after Smash should be allowed to use "melee" in its title. I'm not going to lie, but if those are the only reasons you haven't played it... well, that's a pretty flimsy justifcation. I mean, first impressions and all that, but... Also, on the same note, I admit that I've gotten further in Darksiders than I ever have in Ocarina of Time or any 3D Zelda. I actually really dig the God of War-style combat for how easy it is to get into, I really love the general "90's as fuck comic" look of things, and Navi is voiced by Mark Hammil. Also, you can jump. I am a simple man of simple pleasures. |
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Post by Scylla on Aug 6, 2014 20:53:52 GMT -5
Honestly, I know virtually nothing about Guacamelee, but it's punny hipster title turns me off too and kills my desire to look into it further. Call that shallow if you want, but I think a title like that is pretty telling when it comes to the tone of a game and looking at the bad American Saturday morning cartoon art style only reinforces what I'd deduce based on the title alone. I don't really care how the gameplay may compare favorably to the likes of Metroid and Castlevania if it's drowned in an insufferable aesthetic.
But that's just my two cents I'm randomly throwing out here; I've got no beef with anyone who likes it.
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Post by The Great Klaid on Aug 6, 2014 20:56:32 GMT -5
I'm afraid to, but I'm gonna say uper Mario 3D land is the my new definitive platformer. Beating out Sonic 3, SMB3 and Yoshi's Island. If for no other reason then that I've been waiting for a real 3D platformer until now, and this finally felt like a platformer should in 3D. But it's for other reasons like it being so much fun. I can't explain it, but it is just the funnest.
Also, I think I have to check out Guacamelee if Bobinator is going to dare say it's better then SotN. Which is plain blaspehmy. Or Aria of Sorrow, which was kind of better then SotN.
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Post by TheGunheart on Aug 6, 2014 22:22:46 GMT -5
The only thing wrong with Guacamelee is that it needs maybe two more boss fights, and the updated version coming out in the future's supposed to fix that.
And the animation is gorgeous. Very well timed, and lacks the creepy smooth "puppet" effect bad Flash animation abuses. It also just somehow...works a lot better in game form to me than most attempts I've seen at cartoon animation in games. Nothing over-animated to the point it interferes with gameplay, and the level design is very clear as to what is and isn't part of the background.
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Post by wyrdwad on Aug 6, 2014 22:25:35 GMT -5
Also, Spelunker HD. Game seems to get no love, but DAMN is it good -- they basically took Spelunker, provided a togglable fix for the biggest problem with it (falling off of ropes), then created ONE HUNDRED NEW STAGES, utilizing tons of new platforming elements, traps, monsters, etc. The level designs are superb and manage to remain fresh and interesting throughout the game's 100-stage run (and weirdly atmospheric, too!), and most impressively, the game manages to be SUPER-FUN and NOT AT ALL FRUSTRATING despite using literally the exact same gameplay as Spelunker on the NES. Also, tons of new music (a different song every 10 stages) performed in classic Spelunker style. The only downside is the HD part -- the remade graphics are FUGLY. But you can just switch the game to classic mode, and as long as you don't mind chunky pixels, it looks absolutely fine. ...Also, on the subject of Guacamelee, I have to admit, I haven't played it yet either (despite being a crazy-huge fan of the Metroidvania genre), and it's largely because I don't like the Flash-esque art style (totally agreed with that comment), plus the game's sense of humor seems like it would... annoy me. I'm not a huge luchador fan to begin with, and it looks very much like one of those "LOOK AT HOW CLEVER AND IRONIC I AM" sort of games, which tend to aggravate me. I'll give it a shot one of these days, as I can't let any highly-reviewed Metroidvania go unplayed for long... but I'm tempering my expectations. ...Also also! On topic, I honestly think Shovel Knight is better than any of the Mega Man games I've played, and I honestly think Freedom Planet is better than ANY of the classic Sonic games. And yes, I'm aware many of you will disagree with one or the other of those claims, but both games have seriously impressed the hell out of me. -Tom |
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Post by Bobinator on Aug 6, 2014 22:31:27 GMT -5
...Also also! On topic, I honestly think Shovel Knight is better than any of the Mega Man games I've played, and I honestly think Freedom Planet is better than ANY of the classic Sonic games. And yes, I'm aware many of you will disagree with one or the other of those claims, but both games have seriously impressed the hell out of me. -Tom I can't quite say if I'd agree on Fredom Planet. It's REALLY good, there's no doubt about that, but the classic Sonic games hold a place so deep in my heart that having any game "replace" them would be like... I dunno, replacing my parents, or something. I totally agree on Shovel Knight, though. Then again, I didn't really like the Mega Man games until X, anyway. |
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Post by TheGunheart on Aug 6, 2014 23:05:02 GMT -5
I think honestly that Freedom Planet's a bit too different from Sonic to be "better". It's got speedway areas, but the melee-focused combat completely changes the momentum and the boss fights, and each character's special move makes playing as them feel almost like a completely different game.
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Post by jjmcjj on Aug 6, 2014 23:05:17 GMT -5
"Hipster" title? Uh...what? What is so "hipster" about "Guacamelee"? What does "hipster" even mean anymore? Particularly in this context? Is that just the label that (American/Western) indie game studios are forced to bear for being indie (and American/Western)? Because this isn't the first time I've seen this attitude spouted out on here, let alone in general, which is really just sad. And besides Guacamelee is faaaar from the first game to have a punny title, and I'm not talking about "hipster" game studios either. You have your Oddworld with Abe and his Oddysee and his Exoddus, and King's Quest which was Heir Today, Gone Tomorrow, and there surely must be others I just can't think of right now. And not "punny" but there's also the DS Dragon Quest games with those dumb alliterations for their subtitle names (dunno if those were made up just for the American shelves or or not, still).
La-Mulana was brought up earlier, all the times I've played it I never made it far, either because I got lost and just turned it off for a while or... got lost and felt too intimidated to continue (plus dying a lot et al). It's a cool-looking game in terms of art, level, enemy design, etc. but I've read it being one of those games where you're hitting switches without having any idea what they just did (and might affect a completely different level altogether?), and apparently you can get yourself trapped in levels if you did something wrong that you had no way of foreseeing unless you looked at some clue somewhere else first? I have no idea, I did try out the first dungeon/temple/whatever it was and I never could shake the feeling that everything that I was doing in there would screw me over somehow later on - don't touch that switch!, don't collect that item just yet!, don't go down below!, don't sneeze! The remake I've read simmers it down a bit and makes some things a bit more accessible; it looks pretty good, I imagine many have cried foul over that (which leads me to wonder which version of La-Mulana was originally being talked about?).
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Post by thoothan on Aug 6, 2014 23:11:34 GMT -5
I can already see this thread becoming a flame-war... No offense, but I wasn't aware that anyone besides teenyboppers in AOL chat rooms used the term "flame" unironically. I've had Guacamelee recommended to me several times, but I don't think I could get past the fact that the graphics and presentation suck hard. Luchadores and luchadore-related humor are too played out, man. LMAO tell me about this luchador shit |
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Post by jjmcjj on Aug 6, 2014 23:42:44 GMT -5
Teenyboppers use AOL chat rooms? People still use AOL chatrooms? Also "flame war" I'm pretty sure is still a commonly used term when heated exchanges and insults are thrown around in an Internet thread or some other confined space online.
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Post by wyrdwad on Aug 6, 2014 23:49:20 GMT -5
"Hipster" title? Uh...what? What is so "hipster" about "Guacamelee"? What does "hipster" even mean anymore? Particularly in this context? Is that just the label that (American/Western) indie game studios are forced to bear for being indie (and American/Western)? Because this isn't the first time I've seen this attitude spouted out on here, let alone in general, which is really just sad. And besides Guacamelee is faaaar from the first game to have a punny title, and I'm not talking about "hipster" game studios either. You have your Oddworld with Abe and his Oddysee and his Exoddus, and King's Quest which was Heir Today, Gone Tomorrow, and there surely must be others I just can't think of right now. And not "punny" but there's also the DS Dragon Quest games with those dumb alliterations for their subtitle names (dunno if those were made up just for the American shelves or or not, still). La-Mulana was brought up earlier, all the times I've played it I never made it far, either because I got lost and just turned it off for a while or... got lost and felt too intimidated to continue (plus dying a lot et al). It's a cool-looking game in terms of art, level, enemy design, etc. but I've read it being one of those games where you're hitting switches without having any idea what they just did (and might affect a completely different level altogether?), and apparently you can get yourself trapped in levels if you did something wrong that you had no way of foreseeing unless you looked at some clue somewhere else first? I have no idea, I did try out the first dungeon/temple/whatever it was and I never could shake the feeling that everything that I was doing in there would screw me over somehow later on - don't touch that switch!, don't collect that item just yet!, don't go down below!, don't sneeze! The remake I've read simmers it down a bit and makes some things a bit more accessible; it looks pretty good, I imagine many have cried foul over that (which leads me to wonder which version of La-Mulana was originally being talked about?). Remake for me, hands down. It IS an intimidating game, I'm not going to lie -- and I would've never made it through without the La-Mulana remake wiki for guidance when I got stuck. But the key was, I only consulted it when I got stuck -- I would figure out as much on my own as I possibly could, and only when I started to get frustrated would I fire up the wiki and read what to do next. This worked BEAUTIFULLY, and really made the game a lot of fun for me -- more fun than I've had playing any game at all in the last 10+ years, in all honesty. One thing that really made the remake shine, though, was the ready accessibility of the gun sub-weapon. See, I'm... not all that good at platformers. But I love playing them, regardless! And La-Mulana is a REALLY HARD GAME with REALLY HARD BOSSES. ...But it also has a REALLY CHEAP SUB-WEAPON.  If you're having trouble on a boss, just save up some money and buy a gun (and a stockpile of bullets), and unlike every other gun in every other game I've ever played, THIS ONE WORKS LIKE A REAL GUN. As in, almost any enemy in the entire game, bosses included, will go down in 3 shots or less. And there's no slow-traveling bullet moving across the screen that might miss -- no, it's instantaneous. As long as you're horizontally aligned with the enemy you're targeting, and facing it, you WILL hit it. It makes you feel cheap, and like you're cheating... but it TOTALLY gets the job done. ...On the subject of "hipster games," I actually think that IS a real thing, and I think there's a big distinction between a game that uses a pun in its title and a game that "thinks it's so clever." The problem is, it's kind of hard to express that in words. I guess the best way to explain it, for me, is that a good game will include terrible jokes, but sort of present them in an "I'm very sorry about this" manner... whereas a "hipster" game will include terrible jokes, but present them in a "HAHAHA WASN'T THAT HILARIOUS?! I'M SO FUNNY, AREN'T I?!" manner. Shovel Knight is a good game. It's full of "bad" puns (bad in quotes because I thought they were awesome!), but none of them feel forced, and none of them feel like they're expecting you to think of whoever wrote them as a COMEDIC GENIUS. It feels like the developers knew that most people would groan at their bad puns, and was OK with that for the same reason that I'm OK with people groaning at my terrible puns: because groaning is a form of affection! Heheheh... I haven't played Guacamelee, but I get the IMPRESSION from it that it "thinks it's so funny." It comes across with a certain "swagger" in its presentation that I find indicative of games I end up not liking. And it's not the title that does it for me, but the advertising in its trailers, and the general art style and "mood" the game conveys. Again, it's really hard to explain... but to me, it just seems "likely to annoy me." I WILL give it a try eventually, because as I said, I cannot allow any highly-reviewed Metroidvanias to go unplayed... but it wouldn't be the first time I played a highly-reviewed Metroidvania that I expected not to like and wound up disliking it as much as I expected (Dust: An Elysian Tail comes to mind)... so I guess we'll see. EDIT: Actually, I can give a good example of this using movies and TV shows, though it's... not going to win me any friends amongst hardcore nerds, that's for sure. *readies flame shield* *takes deep breath* ...I dislike everything I've ever seen by Joss Whedon. I know, I know! But to me, Joss Whedon shows and movies (Firefly and Serenity included) all have that exact sense of "swagger" that I just can't stand -- they all come across as if the characters are trying to make themselves seem better than the audience, or... almost as if they were written so that literally EVERYTHING OUT OF THEIR MOUTHS could potentially be someone's tagline. Bryan Fuller, on the other hand (creator of Dead Like Me, Wonderfalls, Pushing Daisies and the new adaptation of Hannibal), is to me what Joss Whedon is to most nerds. He IS clever, but doesn't flaunt it -- his characters never come across as thinking they're better than me, and while they're all written in a very stylized, very flowery way, they still have a certain naturalness to them that I feel Joss Whedon characters lack. Basically, I find that Whedon characters are supposed to sound normal but end up feeling unrealistic, whereas Fuller characters are supposed to sound unrealistic but somehow end up feeling normal, and "approachable." ...Again, can't really explain it, but that's my take on the whole "hipster" question here. -Tom |
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If you're having trouble on a boss, just save up some money and buy a gun (and a stockpile of bullets), and unlike every other gun in every other game I've ever played, THIS ONE WORKS LIKE A REAL GUN. As in, almost any enemy in the entire game, bosses included, will go down in 3 shots or less. And there's no slow-traveling bullet moving across the screen that might miss -- no, it's instantaneous. As long as you're horizontally aligned with the enemy you're targeting, and facing it, you WILL hit it.