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Post by nightdreamer on Aug 7, 2014 18:37:09 GMT -5
I mean, it gets tiring when forum poster Y says "I like game X!", to which forum poster ZZZ replies " No, poster Y, game X is shit, and here is a meticulous breakdown of why your tastes are only befitting human garbage!!!" forum poster zzz is the established classic and in this thread some dude is trying really hard to surpass him |
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Post by jjmcjj on Aug 7, 2014 18:42:26 GMT -5
Btw if anyone knows I'd love to know about a game that surpasses the likes of Deus Ex, System Shock (2), and the Thief games. OK so the Thief games aren't very similar, them not being RPGs and all, but the large levels with so many paths and secrets, sneaking and thieving, and the amazing level design that takes turns for the surreal at points. Plus they run on the same engine as System Shock 2, the only three games that do, so there's that. And System Shock 2, great atmosphere, character-building, being forced to choose your upgrades carefully and the various ways you can take down situations, even if the game in general is very linear, rooms and alcoves hiding loot aside. I recently finished a run on Impossible difficulty focused only on upgrading stats and psi abilities, no tech or weapons at all. It was a bitch, but getting to the point where I could speed past enemies while completely invisible, especially that annoying path to the The Many with the air jets shooting you backwards, the endless rumblers, psi reavers, and bad terrain, and then blowing up The Many with just three hits of my soma transference is soooo satisfying. And Deus Ex, which I see as being kind of a "jack of all trades" combining elements of all the above, not QUITE as well as each of the other games do specifically, but it does them well nonetheless and then some. Just a well-rounded RPG/shooter/exploration kind of game with lots of different paths and approaches to each mission, stuff to find, upgrades also to carefully choose, NPC interactions (something the other games lack since I've read that programming A.I. on the Thief engine that isn't hostile was very difficult) and a really good story to boot.
All I know about, and I haven't played these games yet: Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines, which seems to be considered by many to be an equal to the above games if not better (I actually played through the tutorial, then stopped playing - I need to get back to that), Deus Ex: Human Revolution, which... has had some mixed feelings. Some say it's a proper return to form for Deus Ex after Invisible War nearly killed the series, others think it still fails to do the original justice, that it's too shooter-oriented, etc. etc. And then some crazy foreign indie studio decided to take matters into their own hands and make E.Y.E Divine Cybermancy, which every review says takes every element of the above games and go fucking bonkers with them, with bad English, an incomprehensible story, ridiculously complicated mechanics that if you can figure them out all you to do some wild shit but otherwise is not very user-friendly, the ability to hack anything and everything, hacking taking the form of mini turn-based battles that if you lose will hack you back, and so on and so forth. I've also read it's ridiculously unbalanced, has a lot of bugs (though most of those were complaints during release, I think most of those have been fixed), too many large, empty environments and so on. Still it sounds like a game I really need to play if just to see if it lives up to the label of insanity that it's been given.
And no, the first two Elder Scrolls don't count despite also being first-person RPGs with lots of freedom in maneuverability and character building.
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Post by thoothan on Aug 7, 2014 18:46:06 GMT -5
Have you played new Vegas?
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Post by derboo on Aug 7, 2014 19:27:39 GMT -5
Btw if anyone knows I'd love to know about a game that surpasses the likes of Deus Ex, System Shock (2), and the Thief games. I liked Alpha protocol more than Deux Ex... |
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Post by Vokkan on Aug 7, 2014 19:59:40 GMT -5
Alpha Protocol was really stupid and game-y. After playing Human Revolution (which was mostly a game about reading magazines and peoples emails) you carried that game and it's themes with you for a long time, while AP is practically Tetris.
Now I assume HR is the Deus Ex in question since the original has aged so badly that practically any game is more likeable.
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Post by ommadawnyawn2 on Aug 7, 2014 20:20:25 GMT -5
The good Sonic games after Sonic 1 > Sonic 1, which I don't really like at all You could try one of these hacks: Tails in Sonic 1 or Sonic Classic Heroes. Learning the level design well also makes it more fun as there are a lot of shortcuts past the slow parts... |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2014 23:51:32 GMT -5
Now I assume HR is the Deus Ex in question since the original has aged so badly that practically any game is more likeable. I would like to disagree with the fury of a hundred supernovas. Deus Ex 1 is a timeless classic that neither of its sequels could have hoped to match. A lot of people get pissy about the gimped aiming you're stuck with early on, but it really contributes to a tangible sense of character progression as you feel it improve, and it doesn't matter too much anyway if you're playing stealthy (which is really your only option on the higher difficulties until about midway through). |
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Post by Vokkan on Aug 8, 2014 2:54:19 GMT -5
Now I assume HR is the Deus Ex in question since the original has aged so badly that practically any game is more likeable. I would like to disagree with the fury of a hundred supernovas. Deus Ex 1 is a timeless classic that neither of its sequels could have hoped to match. Then you are a more forgiving person than me. *Hat off* Though this whole topic might have made me extra pessimistic about videogames in general. |
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Post by nightdreamer on Aug 8, 2014 3:34:39 GMT -5
It's amazing how the forum of a website dedicated to the appreciation of video games attracts so many people who hate everything. Yeah, seriously. I feel like you basically have to make a concentrated effort to be so negative about everything all the time like some people can. I'd imagine having that kind of outlook on everything all the time couldn't be healthy for anybody, but what do I know? :V The good news is all 3 of you inspired me to get SORR, and I've just now played through it, and I agree that it's better than vanilla SOR. It's more content-rich, and the arranged soundtrack really serves to make the SoR3 tracks sound a whole lot better. I wouldn't say this is the best beat-em-up I've played, but it's among my upper echelons. My only complaint is that there's a difficulty spike around the last two stages, because I would've 1cc'd the game if I was prepared for them. But really, it's an amazingly put-together love letter to all things SOR and beat-em-ups. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2014 3:48:11 GMT -5
I like Mega Man III better than Mega Man II. There, I said it.
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Post by Feynman on Aug 8, 2014 5:17:38 GMT -5
That's because Mega Man III is better than Mega Man II.
RE: Deus Ex, I still think it's the best game in its genre. Human Revolution is okay, but it lacks the level of organic interactivity with the environment that Deus Ex has. In fact, basically every game in the genre, from Bloodlines to System Shock 2 to everything else fall far short of Deus Ex when it comes to just how much agency the user is given. There's a certain fundamental difference in design that went into making Deus Ex. Like, other games will have [objective] you need to accomplish and give you a few different ways of doing it, but these ways are still rigidly defined: the sneaky way, the violent way, the hacking way, that sort of thing.
Deus Ex has some of that too of course, but it also has a lot more natural interaction with the world, and it feels far less scripted. You can take a sneaky way or a violent way, sure, and you can hack, but you can also do all kinds of other things. Find a wooden door that you can lockpick? Well, why not just explode it instead? Want to carry around a large crate so that you can quickly drop it and use it like a cartoonish form of mobile cover? Sure! Stack boxes and climb over a wall blocking your path, or use your large collection of wall-mounted explosive charges as the world's least practical climbing tool.
Where other games in the genre offer more scripted options and make the player's interaction with the world very structured, Deus Ex simply defines how the objects in the world interact with the player and each other, and then lets the user go nuts and see what they can do. Very few games even attempt that style of design, let alone pull it off so successfully.
I dunno, I could babble about Deus Ex all day really. I've played it to completion quite literally dozens of times. It's my favorite game, and I have opinions about it.
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Post by moran on Aug 8, 2014 7:46:52 GMT -5
I like Mega Man III better than Mega Man II. There, I said it. You son of a bitch. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2014 8:07:17 GMT -5
I like Mega Man III better than Mega Man II. There, I said it. I really want to like Mega Man III more but find the level design just makes little sense to me. Some of the robot masters stages incredibly loosely adhere to the "theme" of the levels and I think the Doc Robot repeats kill the pacing. Mind you I know Metal Blades totally break Mega Man II so the fact I am willing to overlook that means you can safely ignore my opinion :-) |
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Post by kaoru on Aug 8, 2014 9:36:55 GMT -5
I like Mega Man III better than Mega Man II. There, I said it. I like Dragon Age II more than Origins. There, chocke on that one ;P |
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Post by nightdreamer on Aug 8, 2014 10:01:00 GMT -5
I like Mega Man III better than Mega Man II. There, I said it. I like Dragon Age II more than Origins. There, chocke on that one ;P I like Superman 64 better than Arkham Asylum. Try and beat that! |
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